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Viper Series Weapons and Sleep Rebalancing.

6 replies [Last post]
Sun, 05/12/2013 - 17:51
Whitechocolatechip's picture
Whitechocolatechip

WARNING: The following post is a LENGTHY post about REBALANCING the sleep status effect and NEW WEAPONRY. Trolls/Change haters leave now and save yourself frustration with yet another person making one of these threads. You have been warned.

Sorry for all the caps and poor formatting in advance.

Index:
I. Sleep Is Broken.
II. Goal Of The New Weaponry
III. Base Concept For New Weaponry
IV. Model Specifics

I. SLEEP IS BROKEN.

As some people may or may not know, sleep currently only exists in sleep vials but used to exist in certain other areas, such as Slooms. (http://wiki.spiralknights.com/Lichen#Sloom)

Sleep was removed primarily due to being exploitable. Why? People who were put to sleep would wake up and receive healing. This was bad. Now Since sleep only exists in sleep vials, it is, in essence, useless. It heals enemies after the period is over, even if it does invoke the most potent debilitating effects of any status effect. (Paralysis and inability to attack)

Though opinions may vary, sleep vials are widely regarded as USELESS. The healing period is a considerable drawback and it's far less effective in some cases as other debilitating status effects such as Freeze, Stun, Poison, or Shock.

I now propose a somewhat bold solution to sleep... modifying damage input. Say a monster is put to sleep, during its sleep duration, it simply takes all damage as resistant to damage, instead of healing. This makes sleep a good method of both incapacitating both players and monsters without the drawback/exploit of health restoration, but trades it out for another damage reducing effect. You may think "well players could just do this to sponge damage" To this I reply, they are unable to retaliate and they as such will pull far less aggro, so they can't really take advantage of damage reducing without it ending a split second later when another ally starts actually attacking.

Take it or leave it, either way I believe it'd be an improvement over current sleep status.

II. GOAL OF NEW WEAPONRY

As a fun idea of utilizing the new sleep effect, I've already thought of a new weapon as kind of an example/daydream of a sleep-utilizing weapon.
Moreover, this weapon isn't JUST about sleep, it's a broader spectrum support weapon that sacrifices low DPS for fairly high status proc and even a split chain for poison-inducing options.

This game needs better support weaponry.

The weapon would accomplish its goal with higher rate of fire instead of stupid high proc chance, and the strength of the effect isn't necessarily OP either.

III. BASE CONCEPT OF WEAPONRY

The weapon series has 3, 4, and 5 star variants. These variants are very similar in their distribution to the Antigua series; that is to say, they have a base 3 star, then a split for 2 chains for 4 and 5 star. This weapon would most likely be available at the Hall of Heroes from the Gunslinger, and should be accompanied by parallel weapons in the form of bombs and swords to maintain balance.

Unfortunately I like guns a lot, and as such I'm using my baize to come up with a gun series. Ya rly.

The function of the weapon would be incredibly low DPS compared to most other weapons and not very agile or ranged in use. It would however support teammates with helpful crowd control or even single target effects, and isn't as immobile as say, an autogun or magnus series weapon.

It would hold 2 "vollies" per clip. Utilizing 3 shot bursts and relatively slow projectiles, you can move very slowly while moving and even adjust your aim as you fire/move so you can distribute the payload across multiple targets if need be. The splash of the projectiles would be small and the damage miniscule, with no knockback.

The charge attack would feature a 6 shot spread along a 45-90 degree cone, delivered similar to a shotgun blast. You cannot move until the charge attack is finished.

IV. MODEL SPECIFICS

a. The Viper (3 star, rough draft @ http://imageshack.us/f/829/vipern.png/):

Low weapon range. Charge attack is a single spread of 6 projectiles. Projectiles are slow but have (relative to star rating) somewhat better damage than its upgraded forms, since it has no status effect yet. Poor defensive weapon but decent for suppressive fire if another ally is taking lead. Normal damage type, low splash size.

b. The Pacifier (4 star, rough draft @ http://imageshack.us/f/24/pacifier.png/)

Slightly increased weapon range. Charge attack carries 8 projectiles instead of 6, and is fired twice. Projectiles are somewhat faster but have (relative to star rating) poorer damage than the viper, in turn for a chance to invoke Sleep Status. Still a poor defensive weapon, but is good for crowd control as it can temporarily disable some members of the crowd with sleep status. Normal damage type, low splash size.

c. The Cobra (4 star, rough draft @ http://imageshack.us/f/825/cobrao.png/)

Slightly increased weapon range. Charge attack carries 6 projectiles, like the viper, but is fired twice. Projectiles are the same speed as viper and look like low-energy bolts, with damage roughly equivalent to the pacifier with a chance to invoke Poison Status. Somewhat better defensive weapon, since its poison can temporarily amplify incoming damage, does not have great crowd control but helps vs single targets. Elemental damage type, increased splash size.

d. The Sandman (5 star, rough draft @ http://imageshack.us/f/404/sandmang.png/)

Same weapon range as 4 star. Charge attack carries 8 projectiles and is fired thrice. Projectiles are somewhat faster again but still do not have (relative to star rating) high damage output. Still invokes sleep, probably with identical strength and proc chance. Still a poor defensive weapon, but better than Pacifier due to further improved charge attack and somewhat higher damage. Very good for crowd control. Normal damage, low splash size.

e. The Diamondback (5 star, rough draft @ http://imageshack.us/f/692/diamondback.png/)

Same weapon range as 5 star. Charge attack carries 6 projectiles and is fired thrice. Projectiles are somewhat faster again but still do not have (relative to star rating) high damage output. Still invokes poison, probably identical strength and proc chance. Can be a decent defensive weapon, seeing how it amplifies damage with poison and charge attack produces acceptable (but still not great) DPS. Decent for crowd control or single target due to splash size and poison effect. Elemental damage, same splash size as Cobra.

I believe this would be a welcome addition to the game, and would appreciate if anyone had counterpart ideas to pitch for other weapon families (AKA swords and bombs)

Diverse opinions are appreciated, as I'm sure this carries both good and bad. Take it or leave it.

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 22:20
#1
Hexzyle's picture
Hexzyle
Hey, I think you got sleep

Hey, I think you got sleep status done alright. There's still the factor of when you fall asleep = rage period where you can't do jack though.

I still think that no weapon should inflict sleep, and rebalancing sleep should be for the sole purpose of bringing slooms back.

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 22:53
#2
Whitechocolatechip's picture
Whitechocolatechip
Well...

that is true, sleep is the most debilitating of all statuses, however it's also the shortest lasting, if I'm not mistaken. The point is also that the proc strength isn't huge, but enough to make a difference.

Would getting hit by sleep be annoying? Yes. Would it be worse than being frozen? Probably not. Freeze definitely inflicts a large quantity of damage and disallows aiming, and in turn basically makes you useless as well. And it lasts longer.

For PVP, this would be a poor weapon choice for sure... and I had another fun idea that teammates could poke you or hit you or something for "HEY WAKE UP!" type stuff, but I'm not sure if that's practical.

Mon, 05/13/2013 - 00:16
#3
Hexzyle's picture
Hexzyle
@Whitechocolatechip

Would it be worse than being frozen? Probably not. Freeze definitely inflicts a large quantity of damage and disallows aiming, and in turn basically makes you useless as well. And it lasts longer

I disagree. Being frozen as a bomber is barely an issue, or if you're wielding a Flourish, Sealed, or Troika and you plan your facing, you can still fend for yourself.

Stun is the worst status, luckily it doesn't last long.

Mon, 05/13/2013 - 04:01
#4
Zeddy's picture
Zeddy

What do you mean freeze lasts longer? It lasts for two seconds, then you shield a hit and you're free.

Mon, 05/13/2013 - 13:19
#5
Whitechocolatechip's picture
Whitechocolatechip
Hexzyle in PVE, this is very

Hexzyle in PVE, this is very true. Enemies have a pretty solid chance to keep the same relative to rotation and range from you, but in PVP players are likely to circle around to dodge your stationary fire, or even attempt to leave the blast radius and choose a range approach, assuming they actually want to do something with a freeze proc.

Zeddy I should clarify then freeze has the potential to last longer, and sometimes that makes it very deadly in itself. Lots of people love using Cryo series alchemers combined with power attacks to infinitely refreeze enemies on hit, usually at 4 or 5 star since they have 7 hit and 13 hit combos respectively. Once again in PVE freeze tends to get broken out quick due to linear AI, but PVP may not always be the case.

Mon, 05/13/2013 - 14:31
#6
Hexzyle's picture
Hexzyle
@Whitechocolatechip

Well freeze weapons can be outclassed with wit and pre-planning: if you see someone firing off Hail shots, you make sure you get somewhere where they can't get behind you, such as with your back to a trap but bombs will pretty much always thwart freeze. Fang of Vog charges are a good defense against freeze too: not only are they omnidirectional, but they will free you as well.
Freeze resist is moderately easy to obtain, with two of the most frequently used armor sets toting some resist to it.

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