Since launch , i only recall 2-3 updates... and not very big ones either. I understand that they are going to implement an auction house soon.. but how soon? Im not mad or anything, but very curious. lol
Does anyone else feel like Three Rings isnt really doing much for this game?
Devs don't read Bug Reports. Devs don't read Suggestions. Devs don't have a Devblog.
If you don't feel like they don't do much, then you're naive. This is precisely how they're presenting themselves.
It's true that they have pretty much zero communication with players, which is a really bad thing. That doesn't mean they're not hard at work on the game itself. If I had to choose between nothing but development and nothing but PR, I'd choose the former.
Devs: I really don't appreciate having to hear about upcoming changes on some guy's Twitter account. It happened with flourishes, then regalia, and it happened again with the Haven change, whatever that is.
Keep in mind that items are like skills/spells in this game, so it would be like adding completely new skills to Diablo
Umm. No. The lack of skills and spells in this game doesn't mean that adding a few items = adding skills in Diablo. And why are you invoking Diablo in the first place? The only similarity between both games is that they're both heavily involved in collecting loot.
Krokgar, you completely missed the point of his post. He's saying that adding items in this game is just as difficult as adding skills in Diablo. Whenever skills are added in Diablo, people have to test for whether or not they'll be overpowered/underpowered in players' builds. Just like that, items in this game might allow players to make overpowered equipment sets or be completely useless, it is up to the Developers to make sure they are balanced.
As for devblog, I wish I worked at OOO, so I could communicate what they're doing to you. Unfortunately, it'll be 5-6 years before I can get a degree as a software engineer and start making games.
Developers not replying to each and every bug report thread or suggestions is not indicative that they are not reading them. It is very possible they read them, just do not reply. Sure, it would be nice if they did - but you can't assume they aren't reading them without any proof beyond a lack of communication.
Akragster, there are no testers for this game. If it " generally works," it's released. Then they polish it.
Kinda like all developers nowadays, really.
Deslare also says that they can make certain updates/bug fixes if it's server-based without needing a patch, as it would just affect the way our clients would communicate with the server(s), but not the way in which our client works. Hopefully that makes sense, he's a lot better at explaining these things than I am ('cause he actually has the technical skills, and he knows a good amount of Java, while I do not).
So they could potentially be ninja-ing fixes to bugs without us even knowing. >.>
As I recall, though, they were giving us patches almost everyday in the first few days (sometimes twice a day even). Those kind of trickled down, though, leading up to the introduction of the arsenal expansion, and Rose Regalia. And they've pretty much halted, as I'm assuming they're working vivaciously to get that Auction House (and whatever that new thing in Haven is) live.
I'm pretty curious to know when they're going to implement things too, and I'm really curious as to what the new thing in Haven is going to be (and of course, how soon is "soon"). I kind of assumed that the new thing in Haven was just going to be the auction house. Though, they did announce that they were working on it, so it would seem kind of silly if they're trying to keep it a secret now.
I would have liked to see a little more frequent updates. It doesn't need to be big things - even if it was just a weekly release of a new costume item to hunt down that'd be fun.
The new "Construction" going on hopefully will be a pretty meaty update.
The game is way too good and the feedback must be overwhelming for an indie team.
The game is way too good and the feedback must be overwhelming for an indie team.
I'd just like to note here that they don't ignore us/never tell us anything because they're overwhelmed by suggestions, bug reports, comments, etc. It's because they choose to.
If you search the old posts in the Suggestions forum, you'd find several threads where developers did read and reply to. Most never got their ideas implemented, balancing added, etc. Best examples here would be the Vanaduke Suggestions thread, or the Balancing Issues thread. Devs replied to both of those, (Some of us even got to talk to them in-game about it) yet our actual ideas (or just general blahblah complaining) that made sense and would balance the game much better than what they did were ignored. If anything, they actually did the opposite of what we requested. (See: Chaos set, Angelic set lines)
It's not that they're an indie team, lack manpower, don't have time or anything when it comes to listening to our complaints on balancing - It's that they do not wish to, and prefer to go with their own ideas, no matter what.
I'd say that in the time since release, the devs have released a minimally healthy amount of content, and if the 'new construction' is at all meaty, it'll take the total well above 'minimally healthy', probably to where I'd feel that they were putting some pretty heavy chops into the game.
Now, that's amount of content, not level of communication. I think that the game seriously needs a community manager type, paid and on-tap, who spends much of their time *visibly* on the forums and in the wiki - the two places that the game itself directs you for "community".
They're a pretty small team, so while I do hope for more bugfixes and new stuff, it's not too surprising that they're hard-pressed to answer every comment at once. There's probably a lot of extra work that's going into just getting the game running in different countries, and running smoothly as it rapidly scales up.
That said, the deadline to apply as a GM was only about a month ago, and I strongly suspect that the result of that has been to limit the availability of dedicated SK community managers immediately following release. (The notable exception to this is the charming Equinox, who OOO has tasked with keeping the wiki in shape and directing new efforts)
If you're in the Tech Help forum a lot you'll know that that andrzej and Poseidon pop in on a semi-regular basis. When they do it's usually very helpful in relation to the specific query. Though, unfortunately, it feels at times that only the really active Preview players seem to be able to elicit a good response from the Dev team, but not often though the forums. I know on the very few occasions where I wanted a Dev to really take note of what I'm saying it has occurred.
Still, just a "We've read and acknowledged this" type statement would be very helpful for areas like the Bug Reports forum. People do need to know, to a certain extent, that certain problems are in the process of being addressed. Most preview players that had some really logical and critically thinking statements know that the Dev team really does read a huge amount of what we say (even if they don't act). They just rarely choose to comment (as kakelgis noted).
Also, Equinox deserves much praise for the wiki work. Other GMs are also doing some great work too. If you've ever used the in-game support option you know that they are pretty swift about things when needed.
I would really like it if the bugs had tags. I have seen it in some forums and it's really useful, both for delevopers and player.:
[Pending confirmation]
[Fixed]
[Impossible to solve]
[Working as intended]
Example: http://www.eathena.ws/board/index.php?autocom=bugtracker&showproject=2
I think I made this suggestion once already.
1) Doctor Who: Worlds in Time is due out sometime this year (standard caveat: as a general, industry-wide rule, never be surprised when video games get released late). Doctor Who is a much bigger intellectual property with a well established, multi-generational worldwide fanbase. It's also one of the Biggest UK TV Shows Ever show from the UK--the home country of OOO's CEO.
OOO, really, really, really, REALLY doesn't want to screw that game up and they're running low on time if they still want make a 2011 release. I would not be at all surprised if Spiral Knight employees are helping out on the WiT game, even if only on a temporary basis.
2) Then there's the bit about the current lack of an auction house in this game. An auction house, if done poorly, can wreck all sorts of havoc on a game. They don't want to screw that one up, either.
3) I don't see how Spiral Knights is anywhere near turning a profit, especially for a multi-year project. If you want more Spiral Knights features, convince more people to join up and buy Crystal Energy.
If I had to guess, my first guess is that they'll get the auction house out and then Spiral Knights will end up like Whirled--still alive, but with a greatly reduced staffing and a slow release schedule. The biggest fact that supports such a guess is simply doing a head-count of the people in the four gates--there's more people in Spiral Knights than in Whirled, but not that much more.
I would not be at all surprised if Spiral Knight employees are helping out on the WiT game, even if only on a temporary basis.
Just to clear this up, since I've seen it mentioned before: the Spiral Knights team is entirely separate from the Doctor Who team, and the Spiral Knights team has only grown since the project started.
We don't really have the time to read and respond to every thread in the forums, but you can rest assured that we do read them pretty often. In my experience, whenever I respond in a forum thread, it immediately shuts everyone up and the thread sinks into oblivion. Then, the next thread I read is one complaining about how the developers never communicate with the players, they don't love us, etc., etc. That's why we want to get a developer blog going, and hopefully we'll be able to do that soon.
P.S.: We really do love you.
One thing you could consider is a Dev post tracker for the forums like some other games. Basically a query that pulls all the dev posts out of the database in one readable location.
=')
I ALWAYS KNEW YOU CARED!
On-topic: I wasn't really expecting a glut of updates when I signed up, because frankly this isn't a huge game. A small team works on it, as opposed to the many, many people that go into a large MMO like Runescape or WoW. They'll come though, and hopefully with the amount of time it takes to work on them, they'll be quality too.
As a dev on another game, I respect all devs and give them the benefit of the doubt that they're working full power.
My concern is that the game and website are not updated enough. What I mean by that is not content, but rather, the main page of any MMO needs to have current events, not past events. The last event was the Rose Regalia promo. That was extended and then ended one week ago. Regardless of content or target audience, I've found one thing an MMO needs to do is to always have something going on. An event/holiday/promotion that is currently happening, and Spiral Knights doesn't have this. There are gaps between these and it should never happen. You can't have someone come to the site and see something old (yes, in the fast moving world of MMOs, a week of silence is a week too long). Twitter does not count.
This isn't a fault or a burden of the developers. It may involve them, but if SEGA/OOO has any sort of community or marketing focus, then it needs to keep updating the FACE of SK. I don't think the devs aren't doing enough. They just need to keep updating whether it's with something little or something big. New promotions, video contests, polls, or even preview screenshots. These things buy time between the real content updates, and keep interest up. If the site is dead for a week, the game is dying for a week.
Would love to see a Dev blog up sooner rather than later, would be really nice, and I think it would probably help with the complainers out there.
Gell brings up a good point. Yall need a Content Calendar for your web site. It is just an internal calendar for the organization of content presented on web site and through other media outlets like the forums and social media. Should help to organize what is displayed on the site to be sure you always have a fresh face. Most importantly, it'll keep stale content from being the focus since content should have a "remove by" date if it is time-sensitive. The content Calendar also typically outlines whose responsibility it is to create, add and remove the content so it is done in a timely manner.
As far as devs talking about what they are doing... I'm a developer and for my own work I'm on the side of early and often since it helps me to develop business applications whose requirements are impossible to understand initially. For me, it is the old waterfall vs agile development processes argument.
Even though it is the opposite of what I do, I completely understand OOO's stance. There are two problems with sharing video game development plans early and often. First, plans and vision chances continuously. Right now they probably have a huge list of things they want to do this year. 90% of it won't get done because things that are vastly more important will surface. Some of the ideas in the future will even be laughable, but if outlined for us we'd take each as a promise resulting in lots of speculation, arguing and disappointment.
The second problem is that customer feedback on features tends to be iterative rather than revolutionary and OOO is in the business of making revolutionary games. They've been making games for a long time so let them envision, build and publish each feature so that it will blow our mind. After that we can chime in with ways to tweak it to make it better.
I used to follow the Guild Wars 2 every bit of news from the devs; videos, previews, articles, interviews... Turns out I got tired of it because I couldn't play. It's a really tricky business this of dealing with players expectations...
Within the first month they had the arsenal update, which included items and new maps. Keep in mind that items are like skills/spells in this game, so it would be like adding completely new skills to Diablo. We're definitely overdue for a major update, but OOO hasn't been all that bad.