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What equipment should all the other equipment be balanced according to?

11 replies [Last post]
Wed, 06/05/2013 - 19:08
Zeddy's picture
Zeddy

I expect this question is going to get a lot of the same responses as "What is your favourite equipment?".

Basically, I'm asking what you think is the right level of power for knights of have. Some stuff is called OP, some is called UP, so which gear is fine where it is? If you were to point at one sword, gun, bomb, shield and piece of armour, which ones would be measuring stick after which all other gear should be judged?

I've got my own ideas, but I'll wait with it so that I can get opinions on the matter rather than opinions about my opinions.

Wed, 06/05/2013 - 20:11
#1
Misten's picture
Misten
The ban

The ban stick.
http://wiki.spiralknights.com/The_Ban_Stick

It is a stick. Perfectly fine to use as a measuring stick.

Wed, 06/05/2013 - 20:51
#2
Magnicth's picture
Magnicth
Volcanic Pepperbox. Beebeep

Volcanic Pepperbox. Beebeep boop boppa boppa.

~Magnicth

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 00:17
#3
Autofire's picture
Autofire
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

Cobalt stuff should be used as the baseline. (Atleast the HoH ones...)

Btw, I think Brandishes should work like the Edges in T1. Brandishes should do LESS damage to constructs than the Caliburs because the Brandishes do Statuses. At the same time, we need a Statusless one to make up.

Err...something like that. I might have a bad sense of balances. ._.

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 01:34
#4
Krakob's picture
Krakob

Valiance, Leviathan Blade, and Nitronome. Simple as that. They're all well balanced, I'd say although boring, Valiance aside partially. It's a pretty super basic gun with some neat tricks to master such as the infinite clip, the mob canon, turret interruption through charge (I have a CTR VH UV on mine so it's totally doable), etc. The depth of Valiance is like uh... Ever drowned in a small pond?

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 07:43
#5
Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

Well my theory is that statistical balance is less important than another kind of balance, where each weapon/armor/shield must fit in differently and serve a different and unique function entirely. Spiral Knights does a good job of this, sometimes. The "standard" armor should be something akin to wolver/demo/gunslinger.

My "On Class and Equipment Design"- http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/80053

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 07:46
#6
Bopp's picture
Bopp
agree

I find Fehzor's idea pretty compelling, and it has the added advantage of being friendly to Three Rings' revenue.

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 16:27
#7
Coelydragon's picture
Coelydragon
Interesting...

I remember seeing that thread Fehzor, and while I agree with it I also believe that there should be more than just various niche equipment. There should be, in some niches, a small variety of armors that fit the same niche in different ways, or at least with small, but noticeable, differences. Wolver and Cobalt both have normal/piercing defense but Wolver is more offensive and Cobalt is, well, cheap. Then there's Brute Jelly which has more piercing defense (as opposed to normal) and totally different, near-useless statuses (stati?) but can be acquired differently. This is a great part of SK: the variety, but it still needs much developing. And that's where Fehzor's niche equipment come in. We need all of those and what we already have. Then we'll have some great stuff going on.

But back to the topic. @Zeddy I think that each class needs a different standard because if all swords, bombs, and guns hit the same amount then swords would become near-obsolete because of the unbalanced risk/reward in comparison to the other two classes. High risk from close-range/same reward as the one that has low risk from far-range and the one with medium risk but greater total damage. Oops. You've already said that. Sorry. But yeah, so I'd pick the Cobalt line gear like Krakob said. It's basically the Goldilocks line. Not to slow, not too fast, not too elemental/shadow/piercing. Not too difficult, not too easy, not too strong, not too weak. Though I have to admit that Valiance could use a bit of a buff.

Oh and @Fehzor I had this totally random idea that FSC could randomly rotate through statuses (stati?) and/or typing so you could end up with a Slimestorm Citadel by accident, then the next time a Freezestorm Citadel with Gremlin Coolers. This way you would be somewhat coerced to create more diverse gears. Payout would be the same and the types of monsters would match the same types (elite monsters become elite monsters, etc.) and the map would be the same and all. My apologies, Zeddy, for taking up this space on your thread. I might make a new thread for this later if the idea doesn't get shot down too fast.

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 16:35
#8
Zeddy's picture
Zeddy
@Coelydragon

A dynamic boss stage might be interesting, but I suspect it'd fall flat. The stages are designed for containing the monsters they do, and it might get weird with other combinations.

When I say "power", I don't strictly mean damage output. I find Valiance and Volcanic Pepperbox to be balanced, but I'm fairly certain VP does a lot more damage if you chargespam. That's okay, because Pepperbox roots you in place. There's a tradeoff from mobility and accuracy in favour of damage.

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 16:37
#9
Magnicth's picture
Magnicth
Actually, yeah, Fehzor's

Actually, yeah, Fehzor's thread is alot better than my suggestion. The standard cobalt set and levi/nitronome/valiance would be good examples as well.

@Coelydragon: While it is offtopic, I would love to see a suggestion for a new boss stratum that changes statuses every time the gate containing it cycles out. Go do some brainstorming on the details and such, and take it to the suggestion forums!

~Magnicth

Thu, 06/06/2013 - 17:02
#10
Coelydragon's picture
Coelydragon
Done

node/82038

Sorry Zeddy. Back to the subject now.

Fri, 06/07/2013 - 02:33
#11
Kimahsonite's picture
Kimahsonite
Combuster. Just kidding

Combuster.

Just kidding that's the most overpowered weapon in the game. Probably Valiance. It does good nomal damage, has a good charge attack and has useful knockback on each bullet.

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