Testing Feedback Thread

134 replies [Last post]
Autofire's picture
Autofire
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

Okay, I'll be adding feedback here as I go.

Missions: seem good so far

Charge bar: I think it will be helpful for parties and new players who are getting a hang of, let's say, bombing? :P I see nothing wrong with it at the moment, but will try it more.

Difficulty settings: I like it a lot! I'm going to have to test it some more.

Misc.: I assume the red and green dots are for testing reasons? Or do they mean something?

Red Flash on damage: I like it. It also let's us know more when we are low on HP and when to be more careful. It also makes the game harder in a way...

Sprites

Overall: I don't like how sprites are stronger than when you try them and then get weaker after receiving them. While I understand letting the player try the sprites, it seems to rip the player off because in a way. I was thinking my Maskeraith would start with the cloak, when it started with a somewhat weak caustic quills. Is this for the testing server? Or will this be how it is in the game?

Drakon: for T1, the normal attack seems a bit strong. :\ (OHKO almost everything, and almost did the battle pod completely in.)

Seraphynx: beam seems a bit short range...but meh I need to get used to it. It seems like a protective move, as far as I can see. (Which is a good thing) The heart attack seems useless...maybe my luck is real bad?

Maskeraith: I like it alot, but that might be me. :\

Bugs and oversights (I'm probably pointing out a lot which has already been known of. I'm just being thorough!)

After getting hit, the whole screen flashed (so fast I couldn't see what it looked like) instead of turning red. Was the first time I got hit in the level.

In the first level of The Phantom Mask, at the part with the statue and the two buttons, it is impossible to place the statue on the left button.

Maskeraith's needle-strike-thing hit a gremlin who was partially hidden behind a block, but it didn't have any effect.

The backs of the breaker shields look odd. (Texture glitch?)

The difficulty slider shows up on every level, even levels which don't have any fighting.

When the sprite guy is telling you about a sprite, and you say " sounds like the sprite for me!" he asks you which one you want again. Also, as soon as you accept your sprite it's impossible to read what the guy's message is as it instantly jumps to the mission completed window.

Spark of life starts me with a big energy blast? Dieing for the first time always revives me? It seems odd...

In the battle for the second level of The Collecter, for the first fight I had the gates drop and the battle music finish before I finished killing the mecha knights for the final wave.

Caustic quills don't stack on a single target (intentional?)

In the hardest difficulty, my stuff was at level 3 after the snarby boss level, but the heat from the previous level only brought my gear to level 2, not 3. I think the gear actually leveled up to 3 without showing it.

Crossproduct
It'd also be cool if you guys

It'd also be cool if you guys rewrote your network code to include lag prediction/interpolation. It'd fix like a billion problems with people getting hit by things that aren't anywhere near them.

Also fix issues with player commands being executed out of order on the server... that's just a terrible design oversight. For example if you shoot a gun, then spin, your projectile will fly off in a new direction instead of the direction you were aiming when you fired.

Moving my mouse cursor while I'm in another program or on the desktop and SK is open but minimized is a big no no. Triggers often when CE is bought/sold on the market.

And if you want these in your bug report system, you can put them there yourself, it is not our responsibility to fix the game for three rings.

Klipik-Forum's picture
Klipik-Forum
@Fallconn

"So, this means more people will do clockworks to do RJP and Roarmy twins to use 5* gear? seems like a good feature to bring back the arcade somewhat."

Wait... how?

@Equipment limits: What does this mean for players who got to 5* before missions, but never decided to do them? Do they have to go back to proto now?

Autofire's picture
Autofire
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

What does this mean for players who got to 5* before missions, but never decided to do them? Do they have to go back to proto now?

That...made me cringe pretty bad. Tis' is quite a punch in the face for those retro players out there.

Maybe knights which were created before the mission update should get a special artifact that allows them to wear whatever the please? One thing which I like about this is that now players can't get Seerus items ahead of their time like they currently can.

What worries me is how we can't test this new limit. What if something is wrong with it!? D:

Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

Oh, I had the equipment thing wrong! For a minute I was happy, but then I realized what Zeddy said, that if I go with randoms they'll run everywhere and kill stuff and the crowns will all disappear before I can get to them, drastically cutting my pay for the level. And then the revive change makes it even better to just solo. Which is a shame, because I always liked the party play in Spiral Knights.

Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

I for one welcome the crafting changes, as it will likely make newer players more likely to stay and play the game. We pointed out that awful statistic to them, and I'm sure they've seen it. You know, the one where like 50 something percent of people quit at or before reaching Haven. So perhaps this is their response?

Shama-Seraiah's picture
Shama-Seraiah
They have finally made an appearance! WooHoo!!!

I was very excited to test these guys out. I was a bit disappointed in the length of time/duration for a sprite behavior and the time it takes to recharge after this behavior. That would be my biggest con so far about them. I like the many options available to them; collars, feeding, skill choices...
I love to help new players on quests and missions, I am wondering how these new updates will affect that.
I did not like the red in the screen each time I received damage, nor did I like it when I was low on health. It caused a distraction for me, considering my full view of previous playing when receiving damage.
Having new looks and new areas to battle in will be a nice welcome from seeing the same paths and structures over and over again. I always am interested in discovering new things.
I am not sure yet how I feel about the crafting and revives being different and no longer using energy. This could be helpful or harmful, depending on the cost. I know for me the cost of guild furnishings is still incredibly high, especially the fancy furniture and candles. Could we equate costs closer to the real world maybe or something less expensive than current prices.
Also I would eventually like to see things shared among different knight characters on the same account; like recipes, crowns, tokens, and possibly costumes, and gear. I have found my alt character unable to unbind a costume to give to my other character on the same account (and I would hate to lose the costume). Our alts already share energy can they share more things.
Right now it would be easier to see how everything plays out in real in-game play.

Frostyhawk's picture
Frostyhawk
except these crafting pods

except these crafting pods require ce, so it just adds another regulation to crafting and guess what, party members cant revive others? = another energy sink, aka players will get angry that their mist is lower and TADAAA quit the game.

This is ridiculous, for every good decision these guys make, they make 10 bad ones

Coelydragon's picture
Coelydragon
I haven't downloaded the test server yet...

But, I think I get it. The loss of half-health revives and the mechanism to force you to pick up your own loot are made to encourage the traversing of easier, simpler levels (they revved the TV?) and discourage tougher, longer, more complex levels (FSC) essentially, in theory, reducing CE costs in the end due to the loss of crown profit. Not sure why you guys are complaining about that. Orbs of alchemy are drops, correct? That just makes crafting even easier! Whoa! Sparks of life? Less LD revving, more conservative PvE revs. Less profit per crown due to less energy being used and less crowns being farmed. Dude! They're fixing everything! Go OOO! I'm going to throw in a SoL (spark of life) suggestion in a bit (of course in the suggestions forum). I am so excited for these changes now.

Autofire's picture
Autofire
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

I think you can use your LS (Life Spark, which I am calling them because SL is already used) on other party members if I'm right.

Wait, what about that Revive Party! button? Will we need a lot of sparks? Also another issue this might cause is because players will no longer be willing to pay energy to revive, instead sitting until the elevator.

Another issue: How much are sparks on life going to cost? (I didn't get to check) If we can get them with mist and they last forever, in theory then we can hoard them and then be super man with energy revives. (Or maybe you don't buy them? Maybe I misread? Maybe they just drop from stuffs? I'm not sure. '~')

Coalitu's picture
Coalitu
Party change

"This change means that there are zero reasons to NOT party with others. You’ll get the same amount of loot regardless of party size."

I can see your reasons for making this change but there are plenty of reasons to solo more.

1. Now that we can only see our own loot, players must stay together. Meaning that soloing FSC(main means of crowns) will be faster than going with a full party; Mostly because of depth 25.

2. Waiting times are gonna be longer due to preferences of difficulty.

3. The majority of the runs i've completed, someone goes AFK. When they do go AFK, we'll have to not only wait for them to catch up to the rest of the party, but also collect their loot.

4. There is literally no reason to revive a teammate now unless you know you can't complete the depth yourself. Before revives were generally mist revives, why would I give a Spark of Life to someone that constantly dies?

It's as if you want us to ignore other players.

On a side note, I think that you shouldn't be able to do a mission that requires a higher rank than yours.

Coelydragon's picture
Coelydragon
@Autofire who is having a PICNIC ERROR!

Yes, but due to SoLs being more rare than CE, which can be bought in billions, less people will use them and prefer saving them most likely. I'm going to guess that multiple revives will cost increasingly more SoLs so probably a ton for party revs. You can't trade mist, so it'll be bought with CE/cr like any other item I think. They do drop according to the notes. Cost will depend on rarity.

Coalitu's picture
Coalitu
Crafting

There's a lot of players that have large amounts of ce. When valuable items are traded many prefer to use ce as payment. When the new crafting system happens there's no doubt that ce prices will go down. That is good, but not for players that have large amounts of energy. You would dramatically lower their profits.

Giggler's picture
Giggler
Frozen

My drakon was only able to shoot down, and upon returning to the lab after the second stratum of A Revelation in Flames, the game froze. I had to restart my computer.

Zeddy's picture
Zeddy

Why do all the alchemy thingies cost 1 energy? You should show the real prices you're going to use, as that's going to be an important aspect for feedback.

Traevelliath's picture
Traevelliath

I played through the Royal Jelly Pallace on the hardest difficulty, and the jelly minis were dropping loot. It was great! Then I realized the respawning minis and even the minis during the boss fight were also dropping crowns...

In the end I made well over 9000 crowns with a RJP run...

Rage-Soul's picture
Rage-Soul
feedback

Opinions on the new features:

- I like the new overview menu when i press tab. its very clean.
- I find the cat sprite at an extreme disadvantage.
- The dragon sprite's first attack is blocked if you have a wall at your back (like the charge attack of the Divine Avenger) and combined with recharge time is not fun.
- The ghost sprite is fine, i like it.
- reviving others were fine the way they were, idk why it was changed.
- materials are fine when separated drops, but not CR... its a pain when your teammate doesn't pick up shared cr, adding lots of time wandering when you will both end up with the same CR.
- why the crafting orb thing? why cant you just use CE?

Firelux's picture
Firelux
Fix the pick up method

the only flaw i see is that you have to go around picking up all of the CR once someone else kills something, just use the current method everyone gets it once someone picks it up but with Materials now also

Jlie
comments

-No health sharing: Health sharing is probably the number one thing that encourages people to party.

-Individual loot gathering: It would be nice not to envy team members who get great materials without working hard. However, this means that we can't save time when partying by splitting the job into different rooms

-sparks and orbs: as long as they are the same price as ce, I think it would be fine. If they drop in missions, it will be more advantageous.

-sprite: I use seraphynx and I don't think the heart attack skill really works. Not sure if I'm doing it wrong though. Great feature though

Stwhitestorm's picture
Stwhitestorm
Seraphynx

I haven't seen my pet successfully use Heart Attack fellow Knights I am teaming with in Rabid Snarbolax don't see any hearts dropping, my Kat is maxed level and still nothing. Bug or just bad odds?
- Divine Crusader of Over Powered Noobs and Sword of Skylark

Sweet-Hope's picture
Sweet-Hope

-Firelux the only flaw i see is that you have to go around picking up all of the CR once someone else kills something, just use the current method everyone gets it once someone picks it up but with Materials now also

Wait what? the Loot systems apply to crowns too? i took was only for materials and equipment? then i would prefer go solo then.
Yeah will sound like "you people dont like changes" but honestly the actual loot system its better. if it only apply to materials its fine. but if it apply to crowns then im going to start playing alone.

About the test:

+ The test update seems fine (about BS) a dissapointment that then again a new "boss" specially that bot... its again a T1-T2 boss... (prolly its a T1) yay thanks... vets again left aside

= Crafting system: i honestly have mixed reactions from this one... but i cant decided if it good or bad until i really have a Price for those Alchemy orbs..

- New Revive System: i can tolerate the "new crafting" system but this one no. So according to you Nick:
Our observations show that health sharing to revive downed party members ends up being detrimental to teams working to complete levels; diluting overall team health to the point of team members being repeatedly one-shotted in combat.

really did you consider this situation: So im on a room where im in battle with turrets and zombies (like Shadow Lair Rabid Snarbolax) my friend died, but i managed to kill few monsters which dropped hearts. and so i run to revive my friend and give him 20% of my health (assuming i have 40%). but then turrets keep me damaging and lost my life to the point went to 5% even i picked up the hearts to raise my life to 50% but then again i get a lot of damaged and end up dead in the floor. but then my friend revives and pick up the health to raise his health to 80-100% and revive me giving me a nice amount of health...

With this new system.. why you consider that 90% of the players would give a "Spark of Life" to revive Ally if they dont have one? Honestly i wouldnt if is a player that dies a lot. and if it a player that its all ready for everything he would have his own Spark of Life.

Most of the new update features i like it somewhat. but the changes to the rev system (specially no more health revives) its the no no for me in this new update. :/ everytimes its like to force a player to play alone rather than play in a group like the game used to be.

Oh well nothing new like the UI update. something change we need to get used to it because the feed back simply would get ignored even if people
post really nice points.

NICK DONT IGNORE AT LEAST THIS: KEEP THE OLD LOOT DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM ITS FAIR. with the new Loot System you only would want people go solo instead party to get crowns and mats

Traevelliath's picture
Traevelliath

I'ma echo what others have said...

The new party mechanics are irritating. Yes it makes a bit more sense and lets you feel more selfish... but it's outright annoying. Same with the rev system.

I liked the old revive system and felt that it already gave you incentive to work with others. This new rev system does the exact opposite of what was intended. It gives you all the resources you need to revive yourself. Before it was a choice between a quick but costly rev, or wait for an ally to help you. Now it's either spend your own money, or spend your allies' money.

Thndr's picture
Thndr
Team Revive

Removing the ability for a teammate to revive you essentially makes it a solo game unless your friends want to spend energy on you.

This punishes teamwork and at higher tiers, diluting 4 bars into 2 still makes you die in 1 hit, but now there are two people to help survive. Someone might have a pill on them they can use after reviving someone, or after being revived. This means that with teamwork and coordination they can survive a difficult fight.

Preventing people from doing this essentially re-instates the punishing methods you're doing away with with the changes the upcoming patch is making with Orbs and Sparks.

I'm not saying make it easier, but modern games give you the ability to revive a downed opponent without shilling out cash. Don't punish teamwork.
Granted imposing some sort of increased health cost per revive per level might be the way to go. Punish the player for dying too much, don't punish the player for dying occasionally.

Stwhitestorm's picture
Stwhitestorm
Side Blunt note to Thndr

I agree the new revival update is nice but shouldn't we Knights get the option to use a Spark of Life or Health revive? I am sorry but it seems like to a lot of us solo FSC/SL artists is that these new updates are more leaned and favored to the Tier 1 - Tier 2 noobs that can't do anything and keep dying due to lack of skills plus the health reviving is killing their survival NOT the Tier 3 FSC runners like I said. Again I apologize for my bluntness but it needs to be said, WHY DO WE ALL HAVE TO SUFFER FOR DUMB NOOBS NOT KNOWING HOW TO PLAY AS A TEAM OR WORSE LACK OF COMMUNICATION. To end this comment I think you should have these options when a Knight die
1. Return to Haven
2. Health Revive
3. Spark of Live
4. Team Revive

Thank you for your time, God bless :)
- Divine Crusader of Over Powered Noobs & Sword of Skylark

Teshyr
Sprites and then the new update...

The battle Sprites are great already, but everyone is currently having Lag issues. Also, the Seraphinx has a secondary attack, defense, or healing system that actually does nothing and hinders its use for a whole minute. Drakon has a fire ball (nice touch) that its cooldown is 15 seconds. lasts a tad bit too long and its shield lasts too long too. So far no issues other than delays.

Now this new update. People with 5 star max level items earn heat that go to waste. Said people give it away for free or a price via revives from another player. With this new update, that will crush Heating entirely and people who work hard to make 5 star items or prep items for Shadow Lair Armor runs. I like the idea, but if it was changed, lets say giving health if the player clicks a box named Prefer Health Revive or Prefer Spark of Life revive, that would help. Or better yet, the Spark of Life revive can be used to revive players that are farther away and Health can be used when very close to provide slight invulnerability and also cover for the fallen teammate.

Loot system will also be debilitating. Just leave it the same, but also give everyone the material that is found by a teammate. Vita pods should remain on the ground so other players must run to it and grab it when called out by a teammate.

Would just like to say this, mainly because of my love and support for the game and also that I don't see many people do this. Thank you Three Rings and SEGA, for a wonderful game that I can come home to and relieve some stress and have fun with guildmates and friends, taking down bosses and challenging the Shadowlairs. Thank you, because this is the one game I can always look forward to for something new and exciting. I am happy and glad to support this game. You guys are really and truly the best.

Sroell's picture
Sroell
My thoughts

Battle Sprites:

  • For the most part, pretty good, but the intro missions don't give you a very good idea of the sprite's abilities. The enemies die too fast?
  • If there's a picture of the sprite next to our knight's portrait, why not have that be how you access the sprite menu? It seems more intuitive that way to me.
  • Realizing this is still in beta, the harnesses need descriptions.
  • The appearance of the sprites themselves is pretty awesome. The only thing that seems weird is the floating animation- they glide almost too smoothly. A little bobbing would make it seem more natural.
  • When allocating skill points, the items (for seraphynx's Ray of Light, it's Focus, Magnify, and Enduring Light) need descriptions. It's probably in the wiki, but it should be available IN the game, too.
  • I like how you integrated the player's personal color in the designs! Could there be ways to maybe change the color scheme, the way you choose Cool, Fancy, Military, etc. during character creation?

Other:

  • I still don't understand the new alchemising method, with the orbs. I don't understand your reasoning for switching it.
  • I also don't understand your reasoning behind changing the revive system the way you did. It's one of the few things I've heard people complaining about. Now dying isn't a big deal at all... I think you should only change either no more using energy for it, or no more escalating cost. Have it like, T1, always 5 to rev; T2 always 10 to rev; T3 always 15 to rev, or something like that. OR make it so you have to use more Sparks of Life to rev each time.
  • I think the new material distribution is going to go over like a lead balloon. Again, if instead of going all the way to everyone gets everything, I think having certain items go to everyone and others only go to random party members would be better. Someone also mentioned that having everyone need to walk though every mat would be annoying. I agree.
  • I don't want to see what I look like without my costume whenever I go to examine my character, I want to see what it'll actually look like! Could you maybe make that an option? You could change it back to the way it was before, if you'd make it so that the battle sprite's menu would come from clicking its mini-portrait...
  • Ha ha, I like the way you're preventing overpowering by newbies! The way it's worded is a little confusing; in the official announcement, you might want to specify that once someone has clearance to use a certain level of gear, they can use it in any mission level.

In conclusion:

The battle sprites are awesome so far. A few unfinished things, obviously, but other than that, they're great!

The other changes... not so awesome. The reasoning behind the overhauls isn't there. Please explain it to us, other than making something up about parties. The changes to the mat distribution and revving system do nothing to affect the likeliness of people joining parties, good or bad.

It seems to me like you're shooting yourselves in the foot by making it so that energy isn't the core of the game any more (make sure to get rid of all the Energetic Knights). Isn't that how OOO makes its money, by selling CE to players for real money?

I can't think of anything else to add right now, and I've already got a pretty impressive wall of text, so anything else I think of, I'll make a new post.

Stwhitestorm's picture
Stwhitestorm
Teshyr

Well said, I would like to second that. Thank you so much for everything you have done and are doing to this game, we all truly love and enjoy playing Spiral Knights I would have commented first if I had the chance but had to put my kids to bed and read the Bible to them. I know you Mods and staff are experimenting with these new updates and looking for pros and cons on these new ideas you had, so thank you for everything you're doing and the time investing into this game I hope to join you in developing this game once I finish computer training. I love this game so much that I can't get enough of it, thank you SEGA and Three Rings may God bless you all!
- Divine Crusader of Over Powered Noobs & Sword of Skylark

Qwez's picture
Qwez
eh... eh blaj hgkti di.. f.... Equipment Limits...

My favorite character to play missions at the moment, is an up and coming 'Knight' named Fe-Tarkus. I am trying to go 4-5* non-HoH playthrough and gain 5k+ prestige at 'Knight' rank for the challenge of it and somewhat roleplaying... Perhaps I could be a 'Knight Elite', but I find just being a 'Knight' to be more satisfying.

Black Iron Tarkus was no 'Champion' or 'Vanguard', he was a mighty 'Knight'.

Please make some way for people to have Equipment clearance through an alternative route other than through completing missions, or allow me to change my rank-title to 'Knight' or some other title.
Perhaps if I surpass the prestige of a Vanguard who only did story-line missions, could I have 5* weapon access? /begs

Nyzmeth's picture
Nyzmeth
Equipment Limits

My wife and I are players from quite some time ago, started during the era when Spiral Knights was just put on Steam. We both played pretty heavily back then, then left for a while, occasionally logging in for some fun. I'd have stints where I'd play daily for a month, then disappear again. I've recently returned and finished getting Vanguard, but my wife still only plays occasionally. She's at rank 6-1 currently, but we got all 5* gear from before there even being Missions. She doesn't have any other gear. It's going to be difficult to get her to play after the patch if she has no equipable gear, and has to do all the 6-1 -> 8-1 missions in order to use her shiny accessorized gear, and in the meantime spend a ton of energy to even get gear of a level to play.

My 2c.

Lux-Aurumque's picture
Lux-Aurumque
Update Feedback and Suggestions

I'm not a part of the preview, nor am I going to be, but I certainly can't wait for this update. I don't give suggestions out on many new things that are added to the game, and this is one of the first times I've done so, so here goes.

Battle Sprites

Maskeraith sounds fun, Seraphynx's Heart Attack sounds like it could use some reworking. I'm also worried about the Drakon's fireball disappearing if one is backed into a wall.

New Items

I am so glad the crafting system is changing. I had all this CE stockpiled for upgrading my 4* gear once it hit level 10, and now I'm going to have the perfect opportunity to use it for absolutely nothing. Additionally, everyone who stockpiled CE to craft will suddenly rush to spend it on Orbs of Alchemy, so I don't forsee any problems whatsoever there. In fact, why not just remove CE in general? Make the game mist-based, perhaps.

Health sharing revives are removed? Finally! I was sick of friends stealing my heat, which I didn't need anyway due to having 5* gear, to place on their measly 4* gear that they desperately needed to heat. Brilliant. Now I can just spend my own money to revive myself, or they can spend theirs to revive me, instead of continuing with gameplay as before, like back when revivals were so ridiculously convenient. I mean, seriously, why go back? Surely no one enjoyed simply being able to drop half their health to keep gameplay flowing smoothly. Now it should be much better, when one knight can attempt to 'purchase' a spark of life to revive a teammate and get killed in the process. No forseeable issues there.

Difficulty Modes

All sarcasm aside, I'm pretty excited about this. The one shining strong point in a rather disheartening update. Don't screw it up.

Loot Distribution

Fantastic! I love running from one side of a level to another, just to hear the satisfying "clink-plunk" of 5 crowns falling into my inventory, if they haven't disappeared already because my teammate killed a monster too soon. In fact, here's a suggestion. Why not make it more interesting, and put the crown/heat despawn on a random timer? I'm thinking somewhere between 10 and 30 seconds. That should keep knights on their toes. And I would prefer the old system, when mats/items were given to only one knight. It seemed the right thing to do. Seriously, if a partied knight finds a Darkfang now, suddenly there's 4 Darkfangs running around the economy. Vitapod distribution, I like, though. Keep that. It'll fix the ridiculous previous oversight of not making vitas droppable.

Equipment Limits

"We think it's in the best interests of the game."

I hope you realize something.
-Out there, buried in your playerbase, there are 5* knights who hold gear they earned before the mission system was ever released. These knights are proud of their apprentice-ness, and flaunt it with flair.
-There are also 5* knights who quit once and will return to check up on the game and give it a whirl again.
-There are knights who challenge themselves by trying to reach 5* from obscenely admirable low ranks. Mr-Hex was mentioned earlier in the comments. Ever heard of him? He's in your playerbase. Go find him at the Rescue Camp. He probably has some strong opinions to share with you about this equipment limit thing.

ALL of these knights will be given 2 choices, and it won't look good for you either way:
1.) They will be forced to advance through the mission system, abandoning their high-level gameplay and items for a forced gear level that will then need to be crafted, WHICH COSTS A SIGNIFICANT AMOUNT OF CROWNS, into 4/5* gear all over again. This forces the player into a particular way of playing the game. Essentially, you're telling them "You'll play OUR way," which is a huge turn-off. They will dislike you.
2.) They will simply abandon the game for the aforementioned reason.

Heck, I have an alt who remains a high-prestige squire with 3* weapons, and he will no longer be able to use them. I'm a bit annoyed.

Summary

Okay. So you feel these changes are in the best interest of the game. We'll see. But a phrase comes to mind when I think about what you're proposing to change: "If it ain't broke, don't fix is."

Here's what I like about the change; you're fixin' what's broke:
-Materials now drop for erryone, yay
-Vitapods are fixed at last
-Difficulty will (hopefully) make endgame players happier
Here's what I dislike about the change; you're fixin' what ain't broke:
-Equipment Limits
-Loot Distribution Changes
-Health Sharing Revives

I have some rather negative opinions about these proposed changes. However, I suppose I will wait to try it for myself, and perhaps it will not be as bad as I imagine. I hear you say "It's for a larger plan we can't announce yet," but I imagine this will be released sometime in Spring of 2014. I'm going to play this update as a loyal knight, but it will have quite an impact on your game that I hope you've considered heavily.

My hopes are not high.

Lux out.

Autofire's picture
Autofire
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!

This is probably really confusing, but what if the other party member's loot can still be grabbed by you? Like, you wouldn't see it, but it would still get picked up by them...

Really it's already odd enough when people run in circles getting hearts and we can't even see the hearts. It's even worse needing to do that for every other item! D: I would love to see more parties, but this isn't really going to help.

Also, removing the incentive of partying (HP split revive) really won't help either. Some people have already suggested this but...why not make it so that you have to spend a little while reviving someone? Getting hit or stopping midway would reset the timer for how long you have to stand over someone. This way you cannot revive them in the heat of battle. (Unless you have your tanky party member take a few hits and draw aggro, that is! Hooray for teamwork!)

Zeddy's picture
Zeddy

The Controls
Are unresponsive. After I use a Sprite ability I immediately hold down my attack button so I can continue charging bombs. However, I do not start to charge bombs at all. Instead, I need to wait for the animation of sprite commandment to be done before thinking about pressing the attack button, otherwise I can hold the button all day with nothing happening. This gets me killed and needs to be fixed.

Caustic Quills
Don't stack up. Your announcement said they would. If this is a deliberate limitation to make me spread the effect out, the spread of the attack needs to be much, much wider.

Heart Attack
Does nothing. Now, I've only been playing on Elite, and I recognize that Elite basically just removes heart drops, but Heart Attack should be able to make heart spawns regardless. You can't have 1/3 of a sprite become entirely useless on the highest difficulty level, that's absurd. You're telling Seraphynx players they made the wrong choice for their battle sprite, and there shouldn't be a wrong choice.

Hexing Haze
Does not get its time extended when enemies are tagged. If it does, it's by a very imperceptible amount. I tagged the entire central courtyard in D25 of Firestorm Citadel and the duration did not feel any longer than when I experimented by tagging just a single enemy. If there is some kind of arbitrary limitation on how high the duration can go, remove it.

The ability also works on shielded enemies, even on the side that's shielded. This is okay in my book; please don't "fix" this "bug" and also make Catalyzers behave the same way.

Maskeraith
Is the best. I thought he'd be the strongest and turns out I was entirely right. With his evil magics he runs my foes through with dark, piercing shards of poisonous death. He can make people explode with his lethal flatulence, and he can make me faceroll traps with his defence buff.

I named him Muffins. All hail Muffins.

The Missions
Are okay I guess. I don't feel like I got to give Seraphynx a fair shake since Heart Attack was really awful for the brief time I tried it. I tagged a dozen enemies and never saw a single heart. You might want to max that particular ability for the test run.

That Last Mission
Was fun. I liked the boss a lot, even though his weak period was not very conducive to bombing. That's common in this game, though, so I'm used to it.

The Evo Thingamajigs
Should be explained. I read every line of dialogue from every character involved and not one of them could tell me where to get one. Biscotti and that other guy both mention the Evo thingies, but neither have a dialogue option for "where can I get one of those?".

Eventually I asked Qwote and he told me they were in the supply depot.

The Difficulty Modes
Are alright I guess. I didn't notice any difference apart from the lack of hearts.

Grantgalitz's picture
Grantgalitz
Abuse block 9000

For manual pickups, I think the idea is to block abuse of AFKers who want free rides.

Shamanalah's picture
Shamanalah
my 2 cents

Is the ultimate Evo Catalyst for ultimate skill?

If so... lvl 90 is a bit much for ult attack o.O

And like many people mention, D25 of FSC, people always divide to conquer rather than taking the long time to go in a squad...

Edit: Dem perks o.O LOVING IT!!!! :O *GASP*

There's a lot of downside and a lot of crown/mineral/mat sink but it has great potential! Don't screw it up! I have a lvl 89 Maskeraith, will have the same for Drakon/Seraphynx by tomorow :D

Edit 2: New charge bar = awesome
Pills inside heart box = new change, love it
minerals inside boxes (found 2 red minerals) = best idea of all time

Hexzyle's picture
Hexzyle
.

@Nick
In conjunction with this change, and after much debate, we are removing health sharing revives. Our observations show that health sharing to revive downed party members ends up being detrimental to teams working to complete levels; diluting overall team health to the point of team members being repeatedly one-shotted in combat.

I understand where Nick is coming from with this, and it makes sense with less experienced parties. However, this is going to be a big strain on how some people play the game, making deaths a lot more costly. It does seem to be moving towards the "roguelike" genre, which is good in a way. It certainly increases the difficulty of the game. But it kinda demolishes the "skill average" of a party, making so very skilled players in a party who never die unable to help the lesser skilled players in the party who may die, even if only once or twice.

There is already a mechanic in place to stop a player with sufficient health distributing so much health around that they all get one-shotted, and often a team with low health can take many more hits than a player with high health. Say enemies deal 4 hearts of damage. If player A has 6 hearts, he can three hits. One to take him down to 2, one activates his Last Stand (if applicable: it usually is with lower star equipment) and the last one kills him. If he were to distribute his health correctly amongst 4 teammates, they would all have 1.5 hearts. This is enough for a Last Stand for each of them, meaning the party can take 8 hits before falling.

I know it's really going to bite my style, I really enjoy diving into dangerous locations to dish out a much needed revive to a downed team-member.
This is going to solve the issue of revive beggers though, since I've noticed a lot of people have issues with them.
I guess I will have to test out the new Sprite mechanics to see if there are other ways in which I can assist teammates.

@Malsvir-Branea
Edit 1: I don't get what Seraphynx's second attack is supposed to be... heart attack? It doesn't look like it does anything and it has a 1 minute cooldown! Also, why is there a red glow around my screen when I hit under 10% health? That's annoying. I don't want that.

Maybe you should actually read the stickied testing feedback thread.
And are you insane? The red glow is freakin' awesome! Now we don't have to die when looking at our health in the middle of combat.

@Nick
Rank 1.1 - 0*, 1*
Rank 3.1 - 2*
Rank 5.1 - 3*
Rank 6.1 - 4*
Rank 8.1 - 5*

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! :'(
Oh well.
How will you enforce this on people who already have items equipped above their rank?

@Grantgalitz
Haha yeah I bet you're pretty bothered by this too.

@Urreta
One thing I can't shake off, we will no longer need CE to alchemise things. This seems like a big mistake, seeing how long time end game players that invest in the game pay for CE have no use for it, they'll now have even less use for it. This will probably affect the CE market in some way.

CE is still used for crafting. Have you ever used the supply depot before?

I don't understand why equipment restrictions have been put in place. I know that the Operation Crimson Hammer equipment needs restrictions, but this isn't the way to do it. There hasn't been any issues with people having equipment above their rank before: They've worked just as hard and spent just as much CE to get the equipment as Vanguards have, where's the problem?

I don't like saying this because it sounds egotistical and blackmail-y, but if this patch went live without changes, without the ability to play on my Rescue Camp alt effectively, teach new players the ropes while playing with my higher-levelled friends, there doesn't really seem there's much left in the game for me. I wouldn't leave because I'm upset at Three Rings, because I'm not. I'd just have to go because there's no more content that I find fun anymore.

I'm praying that the equipment restriction system works like the Expansion Missions: where only one knight on the account is required to be at the specified rank in order for all knights to have the content unlocked.

Regardless of whether I continue to play Spiral Knights, this patch seems like it's going to be great. It's going to rewrite the economy, and looks like it's going to fix it. These seem like some pretty risky alterations you're making to the game, and it may not be welcomed by all. But keep at it.

The-Red-Mage
I will say this, I'm liking

I will say this, I'm liking the Battle Sprite but at the moment Seraphynx's Heart Attack doesn't seen to work, as many people have pointed it out. However, this is still just a test and this can be fix/patch. I also like the ideal of including the difficulty setting.

I could say about the issues with the revive system and loots but then again, everyone have already voiced their opinion and I would say the same thing myself.

Xtweeterx's picture
Xtweeterx
Drop the difficulty adjuster,

Drop the difficulty adjuster, Keep life sparks, Drop orbs (or at least combine them with Crystal Energy). i want more use for my CE plus the game is already balanced as it is without the difficulty adjuster.

But please, REMOVE THE GEAR REQUIREMENTS FOR MISSIONS! How am I going to grind boss tokens with ease? :c Also, I want to take my Alternate account on King of Ashes runs so I can get double the crowns. Please.

I have prepared my face for the flaming from several veterans.

Thndr's picture
Thndr
Spark drops

I was thinking behind the reasoning and if spark drops are rare enough, but common enough, then removal of team health revive might not be an issue.
Only problem is if they're too common then it's essentially free revives.

Traevelliath's picture
Traevelliath

Just want to say... the difficulty adjuster is great. It's the only thing other than sprites that I like about this. It just needs a payout balance. Elite difficulty is genuinely difficult for me, a Shadow Lair veteran, but the payout isn't that different from a normal run (unless we're talking about the Royal Jelly Pallace... that place now has a payout of over 9000).

Aiden-Curry-Puff's picture
Aiden-Curry-Puff
I like most of this patch.

I like most of this patch.

Well, except I would now rather solo everything unless a friend asks for help.

Although we don't have a real picture of drop rates for sparks of life so maybe it won't be that big of a deal after all.

But really, the sacrificial nature of a health sharing revive contributed a lot to a party mentality.

It seems silly having the difficulty sliders on missions-those are supposedly not meant for replay anyway. So shouldn't those sliders be saved for the arcade where they can enable them to be profitably viable relative to missions?

Ewbte's picture
Ewbte
Magnus line is still bugged.

Magnus line is still bugged. 10 shots to hit one ghost block. Qewl, now I can hit it with THE BATTLE SPRITE.

Everything else is great, thanks.
New bos is funny, i like it. But seems too easy.

Troupe-Forums's picture
Troupe-Forums
My Thoughts

Changes to Loot drops:
Making each person have to pick up each individual crown and heat drop is plain stupid, especially on floor like Charred Court, where they'll despawn before you can get to them. The system is perfectly fine.

Changes to crafting:
I haven't played any t3 to see the drop rates, and seeing as I can't actually see the prices in the supply depot I don't really have much of an opinion on this

Combined these two changes effectively kill all uses of using alt accounts to mist craft or farm more crowns per run. Add the restrictions for equipment and alts are useless. Not. Happy.

Battle Sprite Positives:
Variety - The variety in skills and roles that they play are excellent, and will make the game more interesting. Can't wait to see ultimate skills.
Aesthetics - they're all so purdy <3

Negatives:
Global CD - Silly. Please remove.
Having to be exactly facing an enemy to activate abilities - Stupid. Especially with aoe or defensive abilities such as heart attack or that flame barrier thing

New Missions:
Loving the new missions and the levels in them - I hope we get some of the modules in the missions in the arcade as well. Special mention goes to the collector - I hope to see more storyline for him.

The Lab:
Very nice, although biscotti seems out of place. Are we going to get any storyline for how we recovered the artifact, or did it just magic back there?

Cixtro's picture
Cixtro
I have some things to say

I have some things to say about this.
1-I like the new missions, they are funnier than FSC.
2-I like the difficulty switcher in part*.
3-Drakon's Attack is too strong on T1-T2.
4-the CE alternative for craft and revive is great, it would make the CE price low**.
5-Seraphynx's Heart Attack doesn't do anything right now.
6-Sprite battles would make the game easier.
7-I like the gear restriction in part.

* I think the difficulty can be changed by knight's prestige
** About the materials, may they get dropped by all monsters? And, may the Spark Life be used on LD too?

Note: I think this patch will be greater if you add more mist for use, because you will need more materials for craft sprite's food and people will need gear faster for do the mission

Grantgalitz's picture
Grantgalitz
A small thing

Navigating the battle sprite info seems hidden. I had to actually think through the menus rather than mindlessly find my way.

I'd recommend simplifying options and removing elements of sprite control so we don't get buttons thrown at us that act like a magic box for the sprite. This is a mindless game, not a spreadsheet game (yes I know even with sprites it's not a spreadsheet game, but people don't like planning on minutia).

I like grinding as you can take it non-seriously. It allows you to plan it out as well as go on for hours on end without repercussion for lack of such. To throw various UI elements at a player with non-immediately clear effects, this will require players to second guess themselves and start a forced process of planning he or she may not want to deal with.

Scootsy's picture
Scootsy
I have 2 questions

I haven't done any missions, only Arcade runs through FSC (and sometimes I hop on friend's/guild mate's FSC mission runs) so since I'm only an apprentice, will I be stripped of my 5* gear?

And is it going to be possible at all to continue sharing heat with other party members? I strongly suggest DRASTICALLY bringing down the price of heat amps if not.

Rich-Tbiscuit's picture
Rich-Tbiscuit
Item Drops

So does this now mean that item drops like swords, armour, bombs, etc. is given to everyone if it drops?

Heimdallr's picture
Heimdallr

I haven't done any missions, only Arcade runs through FSC (and sometimes I hop on friend's/guild mate's FSC mission runs) so since I'm only an apprentice, will I be stripped of my 5* gear?

"One additional change to support this: going forward, players will have an equipment limit on their weapons and gear. Mission rank will prevent players from using gear deemed too powerful for their experience. For example, a 3* item would say, 'Requires Rank 5-1 to equip.'"

Yep, most likely. "stripped" isn't really the right word, though. You won't lose your gear; you'll just be forbidden to equip it until you meet the requirement.

And is it going to be possible at all to continue sharing heat with other party members? I strongly suggest DRASTICALLY bringing down the price of heat amps if not.

Assuming you mean "heat sharing" by "dying over and over to give all of your heat to another player", you can if you're willing to burn energy on extra sparks of life. This is most likely an unintended feature, and heat has a role in Battle Sprites' growth, so they don't have to do a thing to the price of heat amps, imo.

Teshyr
Sprites...again

Now that I have had time, these sprites are a great idea definitely. Although I have to be facing an enemy to use an attack, its understandable. Point in the direction the enemy is. What slightly pulls me back is that the ghost type sprite, his needle attack is sent out in a quick and wide pattern, and apparently designed for larger enemies and groups? If that is the case, also understandable. But these are sprites, technology the Knights have that are advanced, maybe make the spikes home in on enemies in case if in a frantic rush there is no chance to focus and get it right? One last thing, besides the Seraphinx having a health shield attack thing that does nothing, and the cool downs being very long, could we give our sprites the ability to fly in or about the area and earn us our Materials and shinys if we miss some, or maybe send them out to fly and pick up hidden stuff?

Now, sending out the sprite to fly about and get us items could work in tandem with the new loot system, as in send it off to fly for a certain amount of time, leaving you to get you your items while your teammates are all spread about. This would be sacrificing time and damage output, but makes up for balancing the negatives people have in the update.

Siqmaphantom
The revives. I am happy about

The revives. I am happy about almost everything...except the Health revives. They ruin the game and if this will happen i will stop playing this game as many others will. Now what you could do is give every knight like 2 free revives for a mission(im only talking missions here not arcade). That would at least make it a bit more attractive

Reto-Da-Liz's picture
Reto-Da-Liz
Interesting things I noted

In Elite mode:
- no heart drops whatsoever
- FSC+Vana granted me 9k+ cr

In heart boxes: chance of getting pill/pills
In red (maybe also in green?) treasure boxes: chance of getting minerals