Spiral Knights - Barrier Items? This is a little discomforting for me and my Drakon.

Barrier Items? This is a little discomforting for me and my Drakon.

38 replies [Last post]

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 15:49

Toeni-Sevan

When I saw "Barrier" as an item that was gonna be added I thought it was implementing Hexzyle's idea about getting some status immunity for a short while. Instead we get a clone of the Drakon barrier that does normal damage and comes in almost all forms of status.

This is a purely opinionated post, I just feel kinda...upset. All of a sudden an item that emulates my pet's 2nd skill can be used by everyone.
It does stack with the drakon skill, and it comes in fire, freeze, shock, and poison.
I dunno, I feel like Drakon users got a little less original now that people can emulate it and get different statuses as well.

Sorry if I'm offending you for thinking this way. I am really happy about the update, I am. I'm glad we're seeing updates at a progressive rate, new things coming out often, but this barrier I feel shouldn't have been a clone of the Drakon's barrier. I'd rather have Hexzyle's immune barrier idea implemented instead.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 15:52

Jason-Is-Cool

Wat barrier items?
Put a link for me?

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 15:56

Heroshian

Here Here!

I agree.

I am also annoyed that it is actually more effective (doesn't have the same pressing to activate doesn't always activate it bug sprite skills have, AND can destroy breakable scenery).

It does move slower, but barely. It definitely applies its effect more often - more flame barrier only sets things on fire half the time, these items apply their effect every time T_T

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 15:57

Khamsin

It's like someone said "Nobody is using drakon enough, I want to show off this awesome skill, here, I know, I'll make that skill a usable item!"

000 logic is that if something is broken, you replace it with something better... you don't fix it : /

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 16:03

Heroshian

The irony of course being the

The irony of course being the only skill I DO use for my Drachorn is the barrier.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 16:04

Zeddy

The barriers, despite having normal damage, are stronger than Drakon's flame barrier with an appropriate harness.

The status strength is +6, like vials. Stronger than Combuster. Barrier has +0.5, barely a notch above Ash of Agni, after maxing the damage on it.

The barriers can break blocks, bushes and minerals, as well as interrupt greavers. Flame barrier can not do this.

The only thing Flame Barrier has going over status barriers is the ultimates and the defence boost. That and being reusable every 32 seconds rather than having to be found, I suppose.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 16:27

Jason-Is-Cool

Ahhhhh...haven't played

Ahhhhh...haven't played yet...
Are the ranger signals sent to arsenal?

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 18:05

Kathrine-Dragon

That is so freaking lame... OOO, can we at least have a legit wall of fire in front of us? Like a real barrier. You know, it just sets a 3x1 wall of status-inducing stuff with no damage (besides, you know, the ticks). One more tally for OOO breaking things right after making them fairly balanced.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 19:12

Shotjeer

As Zeddy suggests, these new barriers are just much better than the Drakon shield overall. I tested a fire barrier today in elite T2 Emreald Axis II, on a group of 3 lumbers, and using one barrier, I practically destroyed the group. Nerf these things,OOO.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 19:18

Writhes

Do the two stack because if so then the drakon would have the advantage of a double cracked out barrier, yes?!?

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 19:18

#10

Clown-Nine

@Writhes

They do stack, which creates a very powerful barrier

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 21:43

#11

Aplauses

True. Now my Drakon are more

True. Now my Drakon are more useless now. Flame barrier is what that make Drakon more original and fun. Now what, everyone can have it. (not to mention that the pickup come pretty often tho and deal more damage with variety of status)

Drakon is just overpopulate because most kids love dragon that breath fire so they pick Drakon.

In my honest opinion ...

@Jzthree
But the stack looks fun so I might trying it later :D

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 21:56

#12

Fangel

Mini Jellies still defy damage

Sadly these barriers are useless on mini jellies.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 22:03

#13

Draycos

You cannot fathom how massively hyped I am for the possibility that this means Drakon is getting reworked/buffed/etc. in the future.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 22:56

#14

Tedme

Honestly...

If I'm listening correctly, they each have there own uses. Drakon's is more defensive, which is odd for the direct fighter, but hey. The Barriers, if they are as powerful as most of you suggested, should probably be nerfed down. What of the other pick ups, however? What does ranger signal even do? Haven't gotten to play with them, yet.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 23:07

#15

Fangel

@tedme

In my experiences with them so far, recon flares summon a recon knight with a two-star autogun to fight alongside your party for a limited time. They can mark enemies for death, but I don't know the circumstances required for them to do that. Maybe if we summon Zeddy here, he can help with witchcraft- I mean, science.

Zeddyjuice
Zeddyjuice
Zeddyjuice

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 23:08

#16

Hexzyle

Hmm, well. They are a usable, so it makes sense why they are powerful. But it kind of leaves vials in the dust, doesn't it? I mean, they deal their status 100%, and they're ranged but they don't deal anywhere near as much damage... do vials compare to the associated barrier? What do you think?

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 23:15

#17

Tedme

I think they do.

For the following reasons.
Vials are long range weapons, that deal status effects, able to change the tide of a battle. Where would the JK fight go for tier 2 knights with only the "melee" barriers? I can still think of many uses for Vials.
Also, thank you Fangel.

Wed, 10/16/2013 - 23:56

#18

Zeddy

The way I see it, Fire Vial > Firebolt and Ultra Fire Barrer > Flame Barrier.

Has anyone found an artillery strike yet? I'd like to know if it renders explosive firestorm obsolete.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 04:52

#19

Jendar-Nox

...

Having used the new flame barrier against a lumber, I noticed that it only did damage on three first strikes. All further hits were reflected, exactly like the 4th and other hits of Seraphynx's ray of light. In contrast, Drakon's barrier causes damage as long as it burns.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 04:59

#20

Quaquonfaes

I feel the same, way,

I feel the same, way, "barrier" should be a shield, I feel betrayed...
Dragon is already as uselss as it can be, do we have to burry it more?

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 05:32

#21

Shamanalah

my 2 cents

You wll never separate me from my stun vials!!! (check out the new vials effect too! Shiny!)

They are okay at dealing dmg but Drakon speed buff is better IMO

On the other hand... try using it to break minerals and blocks. It is AWESOMEEEEE o.O (I think this is the main purpose of those barrier) I will only use them to break treasure boxes and minerals from now on. It is wonderful ^ ^

Edit: Drakon can stun each 16 sec with his first ult and has a speed buff equal to LD striker with his 2nd... Drakon is and was good from the get-go. Now you can stack your dmg too if you want... doing like 2 blitz worth of dmg? crazy...

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 05:50

#22

Lanieu

I think they should be outer

I think they should be outer barriers (shields) that lower damage or have a chance to entirely block that certain type of damage.

Poison vents! Use poison barrier and walk over with minimal dmg (no poison status)

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 06:01

#23

Goldeneman

True

True very true, but it dose look cool when you put them together. Maybe 000 should change the drakon 2nd skill to something else?

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 06:06

#24

Narfle

artillery strike here

Looks a bit like a remote control, effect is similar to strikes from mortafires or the light/bomb traps in the Collector missions. The duration is quite short (maybe 3-4 hits), so short I didn't even get much of a look before it was already over. I set it off in the last room of the beastie prestige, so it was hard to tell if the strikes were targeting specific enemies or random with all the wolvers jumping around. I've been looking for another one to test it again under more controlled circumstances, but no luck so far.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 06:32

#25

Hexzyle

Can you stack multiple barriers?

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 06:34

#26

Thunder-The-Bright

great, now my schorching barrier is trash.
gonna check it out right away.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 06:49

#27

Kathrine-Dragon

Easy to balance. Make barrier purely status inducing and give Drakon damage and block breaking. Buff bombers.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 07:46

#28

Writhes

From what I gather people are upset because Drakon abilities don't feel exclusive anymore? As far as combat goes nothing is really different except for having more... It seems to me that even if the new power ups mimic some Drakon abilities as long as the abilities stack then 1 + 1 = 2.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 07:50

#29

Bitsbee

Are the Recon Ranger Flares & Artilery Strikes exclusive to Danger Missions?

@Hexzyle No. I tried making a Fire/Poison Barrier when fighting JK & the Poison Barrier just replaced the Fire Barrier immediately.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 08:20

#30

Orbwanter

Y'all are mad, this feels more like a buff to Flame Barrier users than anything. Saying the barrier caps make Flame Barrier useless is like saying Caustic Quills makes Blitz Needle useless. They complement each other perfectly, you can stack Flame Barrier + one of the status barriers for even more absurd damage, or use one as it wears off to keep a shield up for longer. The consumables don't begin to touch Scorching Barrier's DPS or defense buff, so my Drakon feels just as useful as it was before.

Has anyone found an artillery strike yet? I'd like to know if it renders explosive firestorm obsolete.

It drops maybe 5 bombs randomly with 1* AOE and ~240 damage at d24. The scatter is fairly wide, so I doubt you could hit the same enemy with all of the blasts. It's pretty underwhelming for how rare it is. Recon flares seem great, though. Haven't seen an autoturret pickup yet, I'm assuming it works like the ones in Jelly Farm II.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 08:35

#31

Wolfe-Knight

Hmm

tried it out a little, it was strong until the invincticks kicked in. Yes, they have ticks built in, which I find limits them severely in terms of damage. What I love about the new barriers though is that they pair with dracons barrier. Just use a poison barrier+dracons barrier and laugh maniacally (required for the combo to work) as everything dies before you (Vanas mask never felt like easy mode until I found this combo).

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 08:47

#32

Zeddy

While the barriers do indeed stack neatly with Drakon's, they're not nearly as good as they become when combined with Maskeraith's cloak. Whaddya need a 75% defence buff for when you could simply not get attacked in the first place?

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 08:58

#33

Wolfe-Knight

Hmm

wait... are you saying that if you use a barrier then cloak the barrier stays up? What kind of mad sorcery is this?!

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 10:36

#34

Orbwanter

It's funnier than that, using consumables doesn't break cloak at all, so you can pop a second barrier while cloaked after the first wears off.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 10:55

#35

Wolfe-Knight

Hmm

...you are my best friend now, you have no say in the matter. Deadly cloak, one of the most powerful skills in the game, is now even more powerful (how is this even possible?).

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 14:47

#36

Hero-Of-Cheese

Cheese for all!

And here I was thinking that I was the only one that thought of using the cloak with the barriers. It does seem to make it op. But if you get hit by an enemy, the cloak goes away. I tried to activate the cloak in Compound 42, and it was not a pretty sight. Mostly because I tried to activate it during a mini arena.

@Bitsbee I can confirm that you can get Artilery Strikes besides danger missions. I got one during a Arcade run.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 14:50

#37

Bitsbee

Yuss.

Thu, 10/17/2013 - 14:54

#38

Misty-Wellington

I like the new barrier usables. They're good for breaking blocks.

Search

Barrier Items? This is a little discomforting for me and my Drakon.