Thread is closed now.
~The Professional Answers Thread~
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 01:22
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 01:52
#2
Question Type: Game Mechanics, Predictions, Gear/Weapons
Why are you asking this question: I've been reseraching this for like a year and it's driving me crazy.
The Question: What's the formula for how defence is applied after defence exceeds half the damage it's applied to?
Specific Concerns: plz help kthx
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 02:07
#3
Question Type: Game
Question Type: Game Mechanics, Predictions, Gear/Weapons
Why are you asking this question: I've been reseraching this for like a year and it's driving me crazy.
The Question: What's the formula for how defence is applied after defence exceeds half the damage it's applied to?
Specific Concerns: plz help kthx
Decipher:
What's the formula for how defence is applied after defence exceeds half the damage it's applied to?
What's the formula for how defence is applied <=> after defence may exceed half the damage its applied to.
The question is a Continuum that cannot be answered unless clarification is provided for each individual concern.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 02:43
#4
Okay so, here's how it works:
Let's say my elemental sword does 200 damage. I attack an enemy with 75 elemental defence and then I attack an enemy with 150 elemental defence.
For the first enemy, figuring out the final damage is simple: I do 200 - 75 = 125 damage. I already know that formula.
What I want to know is to find out how much damage I do to that second enemy. That uses a different formula because 150 is more than half of 200.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 02:48
#5
what does hacking do to the
what does hacking do to the servers?
people in youtube hack alot.
But i will never attempt such a thing ever.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 03:13
#6
Interesting.
Hmm..
Logically, if the attacks are separate, then wouldn't the 200 base damage reset per attack?
In which, the formula for 200 - 75 = 125 would then apply to the second attack, 200 - 150 = 50, in the event where the attacks do not occur simultaneously?
However, if the attacks hit at about the same time, like if both the 75 def and 150 def enemies were within range of a single attack when said attack hits, then are you referring to the damage potentially dealt to the 2nd enemy given that the weapon's base damage prioritized the 1st?
Base Damage = B
1st Enemy Defence = A
1st Enemy Damage = C
2nd Enemy Defence = Z
2nd Enemy Damage = X
Your known formula: (B - A = C)
Through deduction, if 200 was the total number of damage that can be dealt by the weapon in a single attack; then wouldn't the leftover potential damage simply be carried over and repeated?
I'm actually curious and want to look into this more specifically,
In which, a few clarification concerns:
I presume the number 150 is based off the defence of the 2nd enemy?
For what reasons would the second enemy use a different formula because 150 is more than half of 200?
What difference is there between numbers below half of 200 compared to numbers above half of 200.
Sorry if this may seem a tad conflicting; attaining every bit of pre-existing factors/knowledge helps determine any missing pieces to conclusively decided a resolution.
And thanks ^^,
Raptor-Zy
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 03:37
#7
The first enemy is undead, the second is a slime. Slimes have twice as much elemental defence as undead.
I have no idea what you're going on about, but this is two seperate attacks to two seperate enemies.
Defence gets diminished after absorbing half the incoming damage, because otherwise proto gun would start to deal 0 damage very quickly in lower dephts.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 06:14
#8
.
ITT: Guy acts like he has the answers, but he does not.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 06:17
#9
what Zeddy's saying
What Zeddy's really saying, I think, is that you're not qualified to run such a thread. Or, to put it more politely, your thread is far too ambitious. Many people have been studying the damage calculations, over multiple years, in many threads and wiki pages. And yet you expect to resolve this issue, as part of a larger thread that also researches and resolves many other issues? That's too much. (On the other hand, if you'd like to make a serious attempt to help us understand the damage calculations, then we'd welcome the help.)
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 06:46
#10
To be fair, I don't see any mention in the OP of their claiming to be an expert on any subject (and the mechanics of damage in particular):
"4) What if there's a question you are incapable of answering?
This is why friends are good; especially intelligent friends.
Basically I'll compile data from players that have a broad concept on any suitable responses and combine it toward a brand new, fresh, steamy answer.
5) How do I know the answers will be accurate?
Because I'll research each question properly so that there's solid information to respond with.
If needed, I'll obtain the opinions of players who are knowledgeable in whichever category the question is based on."
If they want to put together a clearing house for others to ask and answer questions on topics not covered by the official FAQ, why not help them round up answers? The worst thing that can happen if the thread succeeds is to broadly expand forum-going players' understanding of the selfsame hidden game mechanics that the two of you, and others, have put so much effort into collecting.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 07:13
#11
Question Type: Game
Question Type: Game Mechanics
Why are you asking this question: Want to see the limits of maximum damage reduction in Lockdown vs guns
The Question: How much damage does an unboosted (+0, no buffs) Sentenza deal to full Snarbolax set with two Shadow Max UVs in Lockdown?
Specific Concerns: Any equivalent substitution would be satisfactory:
- Helmet and Armor with innate Elem/Shadow defense + Elem Max or Shadow Max, respectively
- Argent or Sentenza matching the defense type, with the user wearing no gun damage bonus gear
Ask around for rich friends to test! Screenshot of the actual damage occurring would be best! This shouldn't be too difficult to answer since it doesn't require equations! Exclamation marks!!
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 07:24
#12
@Momo
Easier test would be a blitz needle shot vs skolver in full max pierce since the damage will be equivalent but skolver max pierce aren't so darn rare.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 08:00
#13
When you're this swag this world just bows at your knees
Is the OP trying to replace the entire New Recruits forum subsection and the Wiki with a single thread? I dunno.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 08:03
#14
Why didn't you spell PROFESSIONAL right?
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 08:14
#15
Question type: Game mechanics and gear/weapons.
Why are you asking this question: I want to know to become a better player.
The question: How much health does a guardian shield have and how do you suggest I optimise breaking one with Barbarous Thorn Blade and Acheron? I tend to switch swing these. I'd rather not charge either because some guardians are actually competent players and will beat me up if I try.
Specific concerns: I need to go to the bathroom, please hurry with answering. Please don't ask me to use proper grammar if you don't, by the way. You're capitalising way too much.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 13:30
#16
o.o
Ello,
@Bopp The purpose of this thread isn't to specifically focus on a single question category; or delve deeper into things we've yet to understand about the game. I do admit there had probably been a great deal of confusion over what the thread intends though; Raptor-Zy apologizes. Sorry!
Ironically, In the event where a games mechanics question had been asked, I'd have likely gone for Zeddy's opinion to attain information; though this becomes illogical if Zeddy is the one asking the question. In which, I have to look for other sources of information instead.
@Narfle Because I never claimed to be an expert on anything :D
What I am capable of is researching and combining data from players who are the experts.
The term 'professional' on the title of this thread refers to 'relevantly responding toward the question asked; given that the question is serious and asked with good intent'. Thanks for responding with insight ^^
@Momofuku Although I can try to answer your question, to get an accurate answer would involve organizing certain in-game tests that require specific stats/scenarios. To arrange that would deviate from the purpose of the thread; and logically speaking, would clearly be too time-consuming. Sorry
@Hexzyle No; attempting to replace a whole sub-section of a forums in a single thread would be ridiculous. The wiki is there for a reason.
This thread is here for a different reason.
@Grimranger Sorry; It was 2AM - 3AM in the morning when I composed this thread. Typo's were practically inevitable.
Thanks; fixed the typo. ^^
@Krakob Questions that need be answered through in-game testings would diverge from this thread's purpose; sorry.
Anyways, I need to re-state/clarify the purpose of this thread through proper editing later; since I'm a tad too lazy and hungry to do so right now.
Please don't bother asking questions with pessimistic intent. So far, all the questions asked don't really assist my original ulterior motives. O.o..
Thanks,
Raptor-Zy
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 14:01
#17
@Raptor Zy
Well you made a thread about asking questions of at least some depth and you didn't place it in New Recruits so I assumed you were open to questions from veterans, too.
As for what you said regarding Momofuku's question, that's not entirely true. Although we don't know about damage past the threshold, we can conclude some things. For example, that the damage will go past the threshold. Let's start by having a look here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkB_kx1fvrxadHBaUFhGVUdlNWh...
We see no damage specifically for Sentenza but that's because it shares damage values with Blitz Needle, except that it's of Shadow damage instead. It's thus 187 per completely undefended shot. Note that this won't happen in LD because your defence will always be at least 100.
Now we need the defence for a Snarby piece. I don't know where it might be written down but what we do know is that Snarby has the same amount of Shadow defence as Chaos has Elemental. Have a look here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkB_kx1fvrxadHBaUFhGVUdlNWh...
By subtracting the damage done to a Chaos user with Nova Driver from the pure damage of Nova Driver, we see that the defence is 126, or 63 per piece.
We then need the numbers for Max UVs. We find them here:
http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/90606#comment-803318
25.6 per UV, or 51.2 in total. 126+51.2=177.2 total defence.
That's a lot of Shadow defence! Our problem is that it's way past half of 187 and thus, we can't do much maths on it. We can however conclude that the damage inflicted per shot will be pretty dang low. I'd guess 25 at most.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 16:01
#18
@Krakob
Well you made a thread about asking questions of at least some depth and you didn't place it in New Recruits so I assumed you were open to questions from veterans, too.
Yeah; I apologize. I had been careless when creating this thread and made its intentions far too broad and ambiguous; from that, a great deal of unwarranted misunderstandings and misinterpretations were caused.
Under this given situation, I suppose it'd be best to clarify the original motives already.
The thread was not placed in "New Recruits" because it wasn't intended to answer novice questions.
However, this thread was not intended to answer veteran questions either.
Thus, the questions expected to be answered are of greater depth than what new recruits would expect and lesser depth than what veterans would expect.
Basically:
New Recruit Expectations < The intentions of this thread < Veteran Expectations
I still need to specify certain parts more clearly.. though i can do that later when convenient
Thanks ^^ This is a wonderful trail and error run.
-------
EDIT:
-------
And as for Momofuku's question, your references and calculations are very nice ^^
Raptor-Zy applauds.
Though my reasons for declining a response for it weren't solely due to the potential calculations; rather, the statements at the end of said question had given off the impression that Momofuku certainly wanted screenshots of the actual damage dealt within live In-Game tests; of which, would be the more time-consuming part of the possible response(s).
Of course, I could simply be misinterpreting the question and causing even more unwanted confusion; should that occur, I apologize in advance.
Therefore, I'll also leave it at that and hope that no further concerns regarding this arise.
Please, do feel free to point out additional flaws with this thread's topic before a complete rework of it is attempted.
Many thanks to any/all involved ^^
Raptor'z
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 16:07
#19
How do I use the Internet?
How do I get a device that can run SK forums?
How can I open an internet tab?
How can I type in the web address to the SK forums?
How do I become attracted to SK?
How do I log in to the forums?
How do I open this thread?
How do I read posts?
How can I post?
How can I type a post?
How do I double-post?
-----Okay, done trolling.-----
What is better against Gremlin Menders: Plague Needle Fiend low or Volcanic Pepperbox Beast High?
What is better against a mob of Polyps within reach: Gremlin Low WRH or Undead VH DR?
Would Violent Heart Attack be worth getting if the explosions did decent damage to enemies?
Would Haunted Haze be worth getting if the ghosts did a lot more damage?
Would Scorching Barrier be worth getting if it had four orbs instead of three?
If I need to use my Maskeraith's cooldown timer any available time I get, which of the three abilities should I use the most? What about for Seraphinx and Drakon?
Which are weaker: Wolvers or Gorgos?
Who is more famous of the three: Bopp, Krakob, or Zeddy?
Which is better against Shankles with a giant amount of health and never become invincible: Umbra Driver or Magma Driver?
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 16:27
#20
"Who is more famous of the three: Bopp, Krakob, or Zeddy?"
Neither.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 16:49
#21
^
I mean come on, he's from freakin' sandvich land.
Tue, 10/22/2013 - 17:10
#22
:D
Question type:other
Why I'm asking this question: :P
The question: will u be my best buddy?
Specific concerns: I'm naturally high...
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 01:43
#23
I don't think I classify as famous O.o
I mean sure, I have about 150 people on my friends list and I've met people who say "Oh wow it's Krakob the forum guy!" and such but that has only been a few times.
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 04:35
#24
Question Type: Gear/Other
Why are you asking this question: I kinda lose hope in finding even any 4* Orbs.
The Question: What are the exact depths where I can find an Orb of Alchemy with 4 stars?
Specific Concerns: The wiki refers that 4 star Orbs could be found in strata 4 and 5. But are they really obtainable from depth 14 till depth 22?
I hope this is the kind of question you expect.
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 07:27
#25
@Krabob
Yep! I knew it went past the threshold (and if anything, was close to being immunity if that threshold didn't exist) and knew it would require in-game testing. I wanted to see how much difference there was with actual damage vs theoretical damage. Especially when the theoretical damage appeared to be ~10.
It was, however, a "max case" scenario of just how much damage you could defend against with maxed out defenses. Because of the linear reduction aspect of defense, it affects gun damage more so than sword, so tailoring your defenses to near-nullifying gun damage of a specific type would be an interesting way to plan your LD defense UVs.
@Raptor-Zy: I wouldn't emphasize the screenshot part so much, just accurate damage dealt was all that was important. I felt the damage would be within the half pip or less range, so reporting %'s wouldn't mean much (99% hp left?) and it's difficult to eyeball the difference between 1/4 and 1/8th of a pip. You could just get hit once and let the lockdown match end to get the true damage, too.
Carry on...
New question!
Question Type: Game Mechanics
Why are you asking this question: Misleading animations annoy me, gun range is a really important aspect of using a gun yet is mostly missing from the wiki beyond ambiguous "long range" and "short range" mentions
The Question: What are the max ranges for each current 5 star gun, both regular and charge shots?
Specific Concerns: Basically, tried Googling this but got very spotty info. Was intrigued when I heard Biohazard had the longest range of any regular shot gun, which took me by surprise. Would be nice if this is on the wiki somewhere.
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 09:10
#26
I can only answer your last question momo: Biohazard does seem to have the longest range from what I know.
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 09:42
#27
Hmm
@Jenovasforumchar
Judging from this it would seem so. The image is still valid within my testing expect for the 5* fires. In my opinion the best place to farm elite orbs is JK or In cold Blood (both have a nice amount of boxes at the end).
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 09:48
#28
I have School to finish
from the book "The Night Thoreau Spent in Jail" its from English 11 A Unit 3
Question Type: Other
Reason: Because you said you can answer any question and i reall need this question answered.
Question: What about Thoreau's night in jail made him angry?
a. The fact that his stay in prison was too short to make a point.
b. The interference with his protest.
c. The uncomfortable accommodations.
I will await your response.
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 09:57
#29
You know that one Almirian
You know that one Almirian guy on the 2nd map of the danger mission, the one you try to alchemer charge to death after waking it up with a vial? Neutralizer can hit him with the regular shot - but you can not tag him (i think) and you still need a vial to wake him up.
Wed, 10/23/2013 - 12:44
#30
@Wolfe-Knight:
Thank you for posting that picture. this is the very thing i did search for a long time already - if it is accurate.
As farming grounds i actually prefere the Golden Lion Gate T3 because of its nice ammount of Boxes in the Aurora island Glibber Farm 1 you can finish fast and the chance for a lucky run or a Arena fight on depth 20.
@Exerpa/Momofuku:
I am used to throw one vial to said Almiran and kill it with circa 9 Polaris Shots.
Polaris can touch it if it comes to the few fields on the right which are closer than the spots near the button. I can't hit it if the Almiran stands one suqare wurther away, near the button.
But I did not write down the distance yet. If someone knows please contribute :)
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