Spiral Knights - Defense fix

Defense fix

12 replies [Last post]

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 10:29

Blitzsonic

We all know that some "outdated" equipment doesn't work well enough now, a good example of this is the ancient plate and plate line which is supposed to give the players a "tank like" gameplay.

So, I've been thinking about a way to fix that, first you need to understand how the current defense system works:
Most tier 3 attacks do split damage, like the brandish line for example, this means that 50% of the damage will be normal and 50% will be specialized. If you have a lot of normal defense, then most of the normal part will be reduced, if you have a lot of specialized one, then most of the specialized damage would be removed.

Normal defense also works a bit like specialized one because 25% of the normal bar will work like a specialized defense.

Changes:
The "specialized" defense of normal defense will be increased to 50% to make the plate line a bit more useful, this might add a little buff to the cobalt line.

Change some damage
Some damage doesn't make sense, changing it back to normal would make normal defense more useful, but it would also hurt the "specialized" gear(dragon,divine) a lot, the special gear(skelly,jelly,magic) would still be useful, but not that much.
So i've been thinking about a way to fix this:
The defense of your gear gets checked, if you have more special(for example piercing) than normal defense, then the damge will count as the special one(piercing in this example).

Which attacks would be changed ?

Beast
Chroma
Lick/Spit

Jelly
Jelly Cubes
Tackle

Construct
Lumber
Smash
Retrode
Swipe

Gremlin
Thwacker
Axe Swing/Toss/Spin
Knocker
Reaction/Explosion

Fiend
Devilite
Toss
Trojan
Sword Slam(this currently only does normal damage, will select if it does shadow)

Undead
Zombie
Swipe

If you don't fully understand this, then ask.

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 11:14

Marksmen

I don't know if my idea is

I don't know if my idea is too op but this is it. People say that the fire resist on the volcanic plate shield makes up for the lack of pierce, but then how come the volcanic plate mail and helm has 2 status resist and 2 different defence while the iron might mail and helm has 2 different defence but only 1 status resist? The volcanic plate shield should get elemental defence with the bar length a little bit shorter than the iron might shield since the volcanic has a bit more normal. The iron might mail, helm, and shield should get a 2 and status resist, same bar length as it's stun bar length, maybe poison. Lastly, the normal defense of each set should be increased by either 10% or 15%.

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 12:26

Blitzsonic

@Marksmen

Adding elemental defense to the volcanic shield will be in my other topic, ironmight could maybe get an other bar for poison or shock. The normal defense is already a lot more than the bar shows, ancient plate still has the most defense out of all. Increasing the defense bar wouldn't help that much with the damage reduction, but increasing some other things like in my topic would fix it.

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 14:12

Hexzyle

When you're this swag this world just bows at your knees

but then how come the volcanic plate mail and helm has 2 status resist and 2 different defence while the iron might mail and helm has 2 different defence but only 1 status resist?

Pretty sure Ironmight Plate Mail has more normal defense than Volcanic Plate Mail.

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 19:08

Waffleconecake

How do I what do? /watch?v=ErE6xSXDkoQ

@Hexywexy
Is the amount of normal defense difference even enough to make any real difference?
You are the expert on last stands so you should keep those in mind for the hit counting here.

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 20:20

Hexzyle

When you're this swag this world just bows at your knees

Is the amount of normal defense difference even enough to make any real difference?

Probably not.
Piercing is one of the most neglected damage types. There's barely any variation in shields that resist it, only one style of sword that deals it, and the majority of the armors that resist it don't have any themed status resists (fire, freeze, shock, poison)

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 21:14

Waffleconecake

How do I what do? /watch?v=z2X90d7yits

Final question, if you can answer this question you will win the grand prize of physical sarcasm.
Question: Will Three Rings ever balance this game?
a. Nop
b. Definitely nop
c. Sadly no
d. Maybe...

Tue, 11/19/2013 - 22:12

Hexzyle

When you're this swag this world just bows at your knees

I have no interest in sarcasm. Quite frankly I think it's one of the stupidest things humans ever came up with, alongside the "Happy Birthday Song".

Wed, 11/20/2013 - 05:39

Sandwich-Potato

But...But...

Tomorrow's my birthday. ._.

Wed, 11/20/2013 - 05:49

Hexzyle

When you're this swag this world just bows at your knees

Cool. Can I come and murder anyone who sings that song?

Wed, 11/20/2013 - 06:48

#10

Bitsbee

"...ironmight could maybe get an other bar for poison or shock."

Shock, plz. If you look at Ironmight closely, it's Surge-Themed.

If I could, I would give Ironmight Shock Resist & Volcanic Elemental Defense equal to Ironmight's Piercing.

But, hey, that's just me.

Wed, 11/20/2013 - 07:04

#11

Hexzyle

When you're this swag this world just bows at your knees

if I could, I would give Ironmight Shock Resist

Piercing is one of the most neglected damage types. There's barely any variation in shields that resist it, only one style of sword that deals it, and the majority of the armors that resist it don't have any themed status resists (fire, freeze, shock, poison)

So you'd basically change it from a clone of Jelly Mail to a clone of Quicksilver?

Wed, 11/20/2013 - 10:30

#12

Blitzsonic

@Everyone

Original Comment got lost because sk forum messed it up, so i tired to recreate it:

Adding a shock resistance to the ironmight plate armor would be a better idea than poison because I was working on a shadow warrior set that would give poison resistance and msi down instead of asi down.

@Hexzyle
As far as I know, ancient has the most defense then volcanic and ironmight, however it's hard to work with that since OOO "guessed" the bars and all of the plate line have more normal defense.

I've also been thinking about some piercing weapon(a spiked weapon that works like the troika, spiked stun brandish, snarby gun, jelly sword) but they all need some work, so no topic about that yet.

@Waffle
B, they have messed up a lot of things: demos, acheron buff, damage bonus vs enemy on most weapons, normal defense... they probably won't ever fix it(they don't even look at one of the biggest suggestion topics !)

My change would make normal defense a bit more useful without breaking other stuff or changing much in pvp.

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Defense fix