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How Many Ancient Plate Mails Does it Take...?

4 replies [Last post]
Fri, 12/27/2013 - 18:30
Paintool's picture
Paintool

If balancing is still an issue, and I still like to think it is, how much stronger would Plate Mail armors have to be defensively to counter the offensive buffs of Chaos/ Skolver sets?

I feel like my Ironmight absorbs the same damage as Skolver, just barely.
Is twice the defense too much? What's a good buff range?

I always wanted to play defensively, trying to max out normal or pierce resist with trinkets and battle sprite perks to see how much I can tank.
I feel the defense perks are too low personally.

Fri, 12/27/2013 - 18:48
#1
Poopsie's picture
Poopsie
if I were to suggest defense balancing...

I'll say take percentage instead of pure numbers, but with curve. The higher your defense, the less defense percentage it gives.
I consider 50% reduce is very tanky?

Fri, 12/27/2013 - 18:47
#2
Klipik-Forum's picture
Klipik-Forum

For ancient plate mail in particular, with it's only normal defense, I'm not sure even making it actually 100% immune to normal damage would be enough.

Fri, 12/27/2013 - 20:34
#3
Skepticraven's picture
Skepticraven
The lowest damage I have observed is...

Ghost (or crystal) block respawns in the advanced training.
They deal 1 damage point (For reference 1 pip of health = 40 "health points").

If you want to see if you can be immune to damage. That is the place to start.

You may also want to check my thread over in wiki edits. I have currently only tested an ancient plate helmet alone, but it reduces 71% of the shufflebot damage in the D1 training area, while all other single pieces of armor I've tested only reduce it 57% (UVs don't count). The D23 values are even more surprising, as Ancient plate helm blocks 62.5% of the shufflebot damage while Almarian Crusader Helm only blocks 29.8%.

The problem we run into is that the damage curve appears to be linear with armor until the damage would surpass 50%. Past that, you get less bang for your armor buck. Try reading this if you want to understand more.

TL/DR: That Ancient Plate sure makes a difference for lumbers, but not as much for respawning block damage.

Sat, 12/28/2013 - 01:17
#4
Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

That is a very difficult question- presuming that both are at level 10 heat and are supposedly "equal" in terms of price, ancient would have to tank enough damage, or give a worthwhile enough perk, for players to see using it as an option. This is particularly challenging because we do not know how the armor was intended to act-- unless it acts correctly and is supposed to be worthless.

The first way to balance it would be to make it more of what it already is, but better. Give it something like ASI decreased med, MSI decreased med per piece- and then give it all of the specialized defenses at the current level of its normal defense. Something along those lines SHOULD specialize the item enough for players to see it as worthwhile, though it might require additional tweaking to get it right.

The second way to balance it would be to make it into what it should be. Give it something like "knight cannot flinch" or "knight has regenerating health", and it could be made to feel like it was intended, and through that could be made viable for use.

The second way would be harder to get right- too much health regen would outclass even chaos, too little would do nothing. Finding a sweet spot- a legitimate playing style that fits the item- would require a small amount of testing on the part of the developers, before the item is ready to milk the players via the testing server and then further disrupt the current balance of armors in the game. That being said, I'm doubtful of whether the first way would be a legitimate option for the armor due to the way damage reductions work.

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The real issue here is the cost though. Skolver costs a very clear cut amount to make and use; ancient requires a different amount per player, based on skill and existing gear. Under the radiant drought, skolver also has an advantage; it requires no heat to be useful. This would easily be the largest factor when "fixing" defensive items.

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