Spiral Knights - Make the game a little more fun and interactive (by make mats have other uses, return Mist energy, etc)

Make the game a little more fun and interactive (by make mats have other uses, return Mist energy, etc)

10 replies [Last post]

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 17:14

Amnimonus

Just had these idea in my head for while and wonder what other thing about them in order to make the game a little more interactive with the environment.

First off couldn't materials have other uses?
Every material has a description of what it is and what the were used for. This make me wonder if it would be fun to give some mats use in game.

For example.
Combine a ghost bell and a reaper rib to create a sound aura around you that attract lost souls and undead towards you (would be useful in area like the Apocrea mission).

Sinful brew and forbidden fruit could be in a scenario room that has a pot/cauldron that can have special stat boosting abilities.

Vile seal and wicked doll can be used to finish the spell to certain runes located on floor.

Heavy gear, rocket sprocket and silver coils can be used to repair machinery locate in the clock works that can aid you on you way or open up a new alternate path to completing a level.

Redwood and trochstone can be use to create small fire place that provide embers.

Dead gold can be used as a currency in moorcraft manor (like to by a ticked that enable you to use a train located on the left side, there train track there so there might as well be a train that can pass through there).

The list can go but that just to show a few.

Another thing is to reintegrate mist back in to the game but not for elevators but as a type mp equivalent (no magic though)

Mist energy will be worth less than crystal energy and replenishes the same way it did before. If you run out of mist you can convert some ce into me on the spot for 1 ce equal 2 me or if done at mistbank station (a separate feature that can be accessed from arsenal stations) that give you 4 ce. The mist well in guild would provide the same function before and allow mist to be accessible to guild members from both the guildhall and arsenal stations with a slightly higher conversion rate or 1 ce = 5 me.

Uses:

Old uses with new prices:

energy door/gate: 10 mist energy
Mecha knight: 10 mist energy
Self revives: All mist on knight (the amount of mist had corresponds to the health regained)

New uses:

Mecha knight/turret upgrade: 5 mist energy per upgrade
Mecha knight will be able to upgrade into stronger version divided in to types (gunner-bomber and sword-bomber) and 3 classes (heavy/normal/striker). They will also have different AI options (Example defensive AI, target preference, mimic action of your on knight, follow a certain knight, etc)
Mecha turrets: will have an a selection of weapon type when up grade and can go into tank mode (which essential follow you)
Upgrade mech will follow you until they reach a terminal/hub world or die.
Mecha can be repaired: 5 mist
Mecha can also be revived 10 mist

Krogmo ware: battle equipment provided by King Krogmo himself at a small activation cost.
Coliseum gear (recon shield/guardian sheild/ striker's boosters): 5 mist (can be found in random locations)

Beserker sprite mode (remove cool downs from your'e sprite for 30 second): 15 mist

Friend revive 20 mist (revive a comrade with 25% health): 20 mist
(that all I got what can you guys think up of)

Other change to make the game more fun.

Make the graviton lines more fun by allowing vortex to merge together for bigger radius, higher damage, and longer duration (however after a certian size friendly fire turns off).

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 17:23

Urf-Cece

Pretty awesome.

Pretty good idea, mate.
Actually I do find cool the first thing you explained (mats with other uses except crafting n stuff).

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 17:27

Sandwich-Potato

-1 to mist energy. It would make OOO lose money and go bankrupt.

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 17:30

Misty-Wellington

-1 to mist energy. It would make OOO lose money and go bankrupt.

____

You didn't even read the thread and jumped to conclusions, didn't you?

OT: At first I was a little skeptical when you said "Bring back Mist" but when I read the suggestion and realised you weren't suggesting it be used for elevators I'm more open to the idea.

Would anybody use the features you've suggested? (Using Mist to upgrade and maintain Mechaknights, for example). Because it's new, they would for a while. But when a Mechaknight tries to take on a group of enemies, its health will deteriorate quickly.

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 17:31

Klipik-Forum

The fact that elevators don't have an energy cost anymore removes the biggest energy sink and with it the need for mist energy. If you had an infinite pool of regenerating energy, there would be hardly anything to spend CE on.

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 17:49

Sandwich-Potato

Why yes, yes I did read. And I exploded at the convert two mist to one Crystal Energy, with reviving an ally 20 mist but still 20 Crystal, which should be 40 mist instead.

Mecha turrets: will have an a selection of weapon type when up grade and can go into tank mode (which essential follow you)

Mecha turrets

follow you

No. That is just not how a turret works. And if you noticed, turrets are more powerful for a reason; because they can't move.

Beserker sprite mode (remove cool downs from your'e sprite for 30 second): 15 mist

NO. "Oh look I'm going to spam my 3 Sprite Ultimates and let my Sprite do all the work."

Make the graviton lines more fun by allowing vortex to merge together for bigger radius, higher damage, and longer duration (however after a certian size friendly fire turns off).

How about no? "Oh look the Graviton bombs are less predictable and can be used to troll people by hurting them."

Coliseum gear (recon shield/guardian sheild/ striker's boosters): 5 mist (can be found in random locations)

No. If you paid attention before, Nick didn't want MSI really; he wanted parties to stay together, and one person moving substantially faster, like with a Striker Boost, is super MSI. And Guardian AoE health regen? No. Recon Deathmark? No.

Self revives: All mist on knight (the amount of mist had corresponds to the health regained)

Friend revive 20 mist (revive a comrade with 25% health): 20 mist

Wat. So you can revive your friend more times than yourself?

energy door/gate: 10 mist energy
Mecha knight: 10 mist energy

But that makes no sense. At a 1 CE to 2 ME conversion, that would be more expensive than just chucking in 3 CE. At a 1 CE to 5 ME conversion, that would make them cheaper.

-1 overall, though decent creativity on the materials. No comment on that though.

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 18:21

Amnimonus

Maybe I forgot to mention

The mist energy will not be able to craft any thing it's purely to enhance feature of game play, so no crafting, no discounts on supply depot stuff purely in clockworks use.

@Misty-Wellington: It all depends on the player I know friend revive would be used and I am aware they might replace sparks of life (in groups at least) but that but I HAAAAATE the new revive system when it comes to reviving friends I've run out of sparks of life and it suck that I have to leave a friend hanging there. As for the mecha knights and krogmo ware it depend on the player and depend if they need the extra support.

@like I said before no crafting or buying with mist and actually it becomes a ce sink in its self because if you run out of mist you have to wait the day to gain it back or you can convert ce in mist. Not a large ce sink but it still adds reason to buy ce without penalizing player that much.

For mist general is suppose to be a mana point/magic point/skill point equivalent for sk and the amount of thing it can grow as the game grows.

Edit:
@ Sandwich-Potato: Tank mode would work in a fashion that you order (by left clicking or some other button depend on what you use to play) and in which it can't shoot when move you can order it before to go back in shooting mode or it will do it automatically when it detects an enemy, the reason for this that there would be much incentive to upgrading if the use is limited to a very small area.

You do drive a good point on the sprite berserk mode it does require to smash the sprite action key instead of a attacking keys so hmmm.

Krogmo ware: "Nick didn't want MSI" he did say that yet if we look at the game now there msi med on sprites and speed orbs that double your speed. Spiral knight may be a co-op game but co-op doesn't mean to stay huddle up together all the time a bigger team also allows you to cover more ground faster. Not to mention speed doesn't mean you have to split up it could help you reach you teamate faster to help them out if there in a pinch.

As for self revives they cost more than friend revive to give more motivation to go in the clock work in a large team, with the current system it encourage player to go it alone because in a team monster have more individual health giving said monster more chance to kill you. I would rather have it that we still had health revives but Nick said it himself that this often lead to the teams health being drain quickly leading to one hit kills.

Graviton bombs: There are some people who would keep making the vortex grow so some kind of restraint is needed. Friendly fire would turn on after 5 merged bombs.

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 18:23

Sandwich-Potato

First of all, I'd like you to reply to my issues with the LD gear, the mobile turrets, the conversion rate, the Beserker Sprite Mode, the fact that no one will ever use Crystal Energy ever again for Sparks and that would kill off a major niche of CE, etc.

Also, is there a cap for the new Mist Energy? There had better be if it's implemented, which to be frank I hope isn't.

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 19:37

Amnimonus

@Sandwich-Potato LD gear, mobile turrets, conversion rate, etc

Ld gear: "Krogmo ware: "Nick didn't want MSI" he did say that yet if we look at the game now there are msi med on sprites and speed orbs that double your speed. Spiral knight may be a co-op game but co-op doesn't mean to stay huddle up together all the time a bigger team also allows you to cover more ground faster. Not to mention speed doesn't mean you have to split up it could help you reach you teammate faster to help them out if there in a pinch..
I edit my posted A few minute after post #5 but that covers it (i think).

Mobile turret: Tank mode would work in a fashion that you order (by left clicking or some other button depend on what you use to play) and in which it can't shoot when move you can order it before to go back in shooting mode or it will do it automatically when it detects an enemy, the reason for this that there would be much incentive to upgrading if the use is limited to a very small area.

Beserker sprite mode: after further thinking yes it does suck so scratch that entirely

Conversion rate:
In the clock works 1 ce = 2 me
In haven (at conversion station/bank in which you pre-load mist ahead time that can be withdrawn at arsenal stations) 1 ce= 4 mist (3 maybe)
At the guild mist well 1 ce= 5 me (maybe 4)

Natural regain rate: same as before when mist was still around 1 mist every 13 minute

Mist energy has a cap at 100 just like before, maybe there could be ways to expand the cap via trinket,upgrade or armor.

Why instead of sparks of life? Personally I hate spark of life (and hat the idea of literally buying lives) maybe I'm just unlucky but I usually find on one or two in tier elite mode after doing 3 arena on a single run. I don't die much my self when I'm alone but I'n a group I die more often not to mention if a teammate dies on me and both of us are out of sparks of life I can't do anything but drag my friends corpse they will revive in the next level. But even then they could die even earlier in the next level because they don't have the auto revive any more.

Overall I find that spark system is kind of flawed in the aspect that unless your partied with friends, a strange is not likely to give you some thing that is worth about 1400 cr to replace (unless they have a ton of them and don't really care or there just plain out generous).

Thu, 01/16/2014 - 19:48

Sandwich-Potato

Ah, but a Spark of Life is a major reason why SK is still making money and thus running. Plus you get a free revive every floor, which is all you really need. If you die a lot, go to Normal or Advanced; unlike before, quitting a level early doesn't cut your playtime.

Well, MSI Medium isn't really noticeable, and many people both in the forums and in the game have suggested a crippling nerf to the MSI orb drop.

Friendly fire would turn on after 5 merged bombs, you say? A troll comes over and sucks all the monsters into a dozen vortex bombs. Team moves in for kill, explosion kills everyone because a dozen bombs of damage in one hit is insanely high.

Look, turrets are designed to NOT be mobile. Turrets are way way way stronger than Mecha Knights because of their lack of portability and crowd control and multi-hit ability. Making them mobile makes a Mecha Knight more obsolete.

One Spark of Life is 20 Energy. You complain that you only find 20-40 Energy's worth of loot in a single arena?

Fri, 01/17/2014 - 00:18

#10

Amnimonus

@Sandwich-Potato

I doubt sparks of life generate that much money (before the major patch the main ce sink was weapon crafting), so for person how pays to play (people like me) yes buy them is't much, but what about some of my friends who are free to play player (and to young to have a debt card), with the ce prices being unstable as they are right now spark of life can range between 1400cr they are worth right now to the 2000cr they where worth a few weeks back. In short that about 2/3rds of what you make in strata 5 of any given gate. Yes we do have in auto revive every level (which actually hate) and make harder levels (levels in which you die more than once) more painful in the long run.

"One Spark of Life is 20 Energy. You complain that you only find 20-40 Energy's worth of loot in a single arena?" I find one or two after an entire run of 9 depth that had 3 arenas about (90 boxes and not counting the boxes I got in danger rooms) on elite mode and I found one or two (when I'm really lucky) and using at least 3 sparks. (this actually a funny story whenever I find some sparks I lose one more that what I found).

But you might be right that 20 energy might be to cheap for tier 3 so what about 10 for tier 1, 20 for tier 2 and 40 for tier 3. (maybe there can be trinkets that reduce this cost).

The thing with the conversion rate is that it's kind of useless in the Clockworks. No one in their right mind would blow away extra Energy in the Clockworks conversion, and they would eventually save hundreds of Energy by converting in the GH beforehand.
True it's some most people won't do unless they are desperate like the 50 energy revive when your out of spark, pay well t be prepared.

Turret arguement: I got nothing, you made a solid argument there. (actually making it complete immobile might add a more strategy)

Graviton: One troll wouldn't be able to pull it of consider the graviton charge but then again some time you can get stuck with two, so instead of friendly fire off how about a size cap at for bombs? (in which the radius will be the size of a haze bomb and the duration about 10 second?).

EDIT: I forgot about LD gear subject.

Counter argument: battle sprites also give you a speed boost once maxed out and the strikers booster isn't a continuous boost but yes some of the LD gear would need change to be suitable for the environment.

How about these changes?

striker: has a fuel tank that can last for a for I don't know any where between 30-60 second non-stop sprint (your shield remain up with its on health)
Guardian shield: has a preset amount of health that doesn't generate (has all 4 defenses and has the health equal to about 10 plate shield?)
recon: has a fuel/total time limit that you can be invisible take damage will reduce the time you have (total time 60-90)

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Make the game a little more fun and interactive (by make mats have other uses, return Mist energy, etc)