Spiral Knights - Sudaruska/Triglav

Sudaruska/Triglav

21 respuestas [Último envío]

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 11:39

Akarahn

These things can dish out good damage, I'm not here to ask for turbo-buff. It's something of smaller note.

I take Sudaruska into FSC for stun utility, and AoE jazz-smacks. Only problem is, the greatsword's swing that interrupts attack animations doesn't exist for the Sudaruska. (Not sure on the Triglav, you'll have to post here if you know, thanks) The Gran Faust and Divine Avenger both have that, and they aren't buffed for damage reasons because they're a defensive-oriented sword. I completely understand why, but I digress. At least 1 of the lines was overlooked in this area. Can we please get this corrected? It's not much fun to double slap the skeletons only to get a face full of undead pelvis.

Thank you.

tl;dr?
The sudaruska sword doesn't have an interrupt, it's like wielding a cutter that moves about as fast as a steamroller.

Side note: My Suda with UV ASI High, moves slower than my GF with ASI Low.

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 11:47

Schattentag

Really?

I've recently been attempting to solo FSC using a Khorovod. As far as I know, the second swing on Troika-line weapons will interrupt enemy attacks, but I think Zombie jumps might be immune to interruption. It should be easy enough to judge whether you should keep attacking them or get out of their way.

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 12:53

Akarahn

No the zombies aren't immune.

No the zombies aren't immune. My DA can interrupt them just fine =D

The sudaruska just does not have it, I triple checked and got skelly-humped as a form of "you're welcome"

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 13:35

Schattentag

Haha

Alright, well I suppose your suggestion has some merit, then. I guess I don't really see a reason not to do this, in that case. I figured the second swing on heavy swords always interrupted attacks.

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 15:06

Toastnaut

I dunno

I use my Suda and Triglav a fair bit against tier 3 zombies now that they're a bit better, and I did before the buff.

To answer your question, they both work the same way, so the Triglav will be the same as the Suda for whatever problem you're having.

That being said, Schattentag is correct, it's just the (newish) jump attack that doesn't get interrupted. The second attack, even if the first doesn't hit certainly interrupts the normal zombie attacks. In my experience, if you hit the zombie while he's charging the jump attack it will cancel that too but once he's done charging if you hit him any time during the very long lunge animation before he jumps, he'll still jump unless you kill him.

If it makes a difference (and I'm not entirely certain if it does or not, depends whether the attack interruption is based on damage, or the kind of attack you are doing) I am usually using a deadshot set against zombies, so I'm doing lots of damage even though it's all normal to the zombies, not elemental.
If the interrupt is calculated based on doing enough damage to cancel the attack, the damage bonus might make the Suda cross that threshhold. If it's coded into part of the attack, then it does already interrupt, you just have to get your timing spot on.

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 15:21

Akarahn

Hm, that's odd. Must be a

Hm, that's odd. Must be a frame of invincibility or something when using a backspin perhaps? Think it could possibly be an issue with the speed seeing how the DA/GF are faster than the Troika line?

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 17:15

Tsubasa-No-Me

I was using the Suda before it was good.

Actually, Interruption is based on a certain amount of damage in a certain amount of time. Example: I can interrupt with my DVS because I have ASI ultra. OR. I can interrupt with a Magnus line because I have Max damage.

For the Suda, ASI wont help you cancel them, only damage. I think what needs to happen is the unboosted Suda needs to be able to interrupt them...

~Tsu

Jue, 03/29/2012 - 17:32

Akarahn

Well considering I have maxed

Well considering I have maxed out damage via armor and trinkets....there is something VERY wrong here.

Vie, 03/30/2012 - 06:26

Gunnerific

Wait a sec

So its better to put damage than ASI on trokia lines. Cause i feel like gettin 1

Vie, 03/30/2012 - 09:41

Kraanx

to hell with ASI. if its a

to hell with ASI. if its a heavy sword, it should be slow LOL

Vie, 03/30/2012 - 10:22

#10

Avihr

lel

@Kraanx slower than another heavy sword?

and not only that they're slower, the troika's second swing is weaker than sealed sword's second swing... curious (i'll bring some numbers later)

Vie, 03/30/2012 - 10:56

#11

Akarahn

Yeah, slower by comparison,

Yeah, slower by comparison, now slow as a whole.

The fact that there are 2 speed levels difference between GF and Suda, and the GF is still faster despite being the lower one is still quite odd.

Vie, 03/30/2012 - 11:39

#12

Demonicsothe

There are several posts on

There are several posts on the forum complaining/asking about the suda speed compared to gf/da. The consensus seemed to be that the troika line has a longer recovery time on the 2nd swings.

I've found that if you don't hit the first swing, zombies won't be interruped in a full team using the da with vh damage bonus. So it does depend on damage, or very likely does.

Vie, 03/30/2012 - 22:07

#13

Skold-The-Drac

SUUUUUDAAAAA!!!

Ok... let's be honest here... The troika lines still deal with a universal issue... the "normal damage disease".

However, I do agree that troika line (Love my Grintovec btw) has an extremely slow recover time post second swing. 3* Sealed and 3* grinnie sealed wins each time involving attack speed. Issue is that it's second swing is stronger too in the sealed line.. if I'm gonna have a horribadly slow sword I'd like to know I'm hacking the crud out of the enemy in my path.

Alas I'm not gonna complain much since the patch... I love how it looks when I'm wielding my grinnie and a friend's using his khorovoid alongside eachother... screen looks epic.

Sáb, 03/31/2012 - 00:03

#14

Akarahn

Yeah those are the main 2

Yeah those are the main 2 things it boils down to.

It's too slow comparatively to the DA/GF.
2nd swing is buggy with the interrupt.

I love my Suda, and will still use it because it literally crunches for 1400ish damage per charge on vanaduke and stuns to boot. But it would just seal the deal if they could address the speed and fine tune it.

Sáb, 03/31/2012 - 04:03

#15

Fehzor

This would be nice. But they

This would be nice. But they just buffed it, so I'm not going to complain too much about it. What really needs fixing now is the elemental piercing swords.

Sáb, 03/31/2012 - 05:58

#16

Metagenic

@Fehzor

We don't have elemental piercing swords…

Sáb, 03/31/2012 - 11:52

#17

Severage

o_o

lolwut Elemental Piercing swords?

When did these come out?

~Sev

Sáb, 03/31/2012 - 12:42

#18

Demonicsothe

I think Fehzor was referring

I think Fehzor was referring to pure elemental swords :P

Sáb, 03/31/2012 - 13:23

#19

Akarahn

Not sure if I would call it a

Not sure if I would call it a buff though. It's 1 thing that should be corrected, and the speed thing could be intentional on OOO's part; but it's in the same class as 2 other swords that happen to be faster. It would be nice to have some clarification on this matter.

Sáb, 03/31/2012 - 14:17

#20

Tsubasa-No-Me

Whoo! A shout out! ^-^ ... I gotta reply now! >:3

I'm gonna post some complaints that I can see...

The charge now is Useful... Not as damaging as a DA's, Brandish's, or Final Flourish's; But REALLY useful... Currently, the Sudaruska is THE sword to get a large group of monsters where you want them. While the Triglav is good for pinning down a large group, and just Bashing them, Over and over and over and over!

But the combos? Still suck. And My prized Suda (Now with a CTR high UV! ;) gets the brunt of it. The Triggy gets to have Strong Freeze on its second swing, the same Freeze that a Brandish gets, which makes it good to swing=>swing and then forget, for a while... leaving you to safety. BUT, in order for it to be useful, it needs to reliably knock down whatever it hits.

The Sudaruska USED to have moderate stun on its second swing, but it was removed because it is very buggy, when you stun them mid-swing. So the Suda suffers from dealing damage that a STRONG status dealing sword does, low damage. (Seen in DVS and Triggy) Is there any upside to it? Not really.

On the subject of Interruption
Interruption SEEMS to be based on Damage, but its a little more complicated then that. Pre-patch, the Suda's charge did a little less then 500 damage, but barely ever interrupted anything. But now, the first hit of the stun, which does ~100 LESS DAMAGE, almost always interrupts everything. Trojans, Lumbars, all machines.... Everything. This leads me to believe that there is something else making the Weapons Interrupt.

On the subject of Speed
In another thread, an awesome dude frapps'd the Sealed sword line, and a Troika line. He found that, unboosted, the Sealed takes 0.8 secs for the first swing and I Think it was... 1.4 secs for the second. And, surprise surprise, The Troika line took 0.9 secs on first, and around 2 whole seconds on the Second swing. I really don't think that Speed in general should be changed, We don't need a Claymore being swung at the same speed at a Great Sword. -.- But something needs to compensate for it.

On the subject o-FIX THE DARNED THING!
Sudaruska, Please choose one of the following:

Increase the damage of the second swing by a lot. Yes, I know, its a Normal damage weapon, but it currently is dealing the same amount of damage that it would if it DEALT A STATUS. So... How much damage is Moderate Stun worth, OOO? >:3
Fix Stun, put back the stun on last swing. I REALLY want to just keep combo-stunning a whole group, which The Suda should be able to... its a friggan Claymore after all. ^-^
Do the same sort of thing that you did with the charge attack, the last swing deals A bit less damage and little knockback, and has an Impulse afterwards (Think horizontal shock wave) that has lots of knock back and stuns. Perhaps this would help with the stun problem; it does with the charge.
Increase the charge dash, Increase stun chance, change stun to STRONG (Not moderate :P) and make the reduce the charge time. (well, if the combo sucks, I wonder if we could ONLY use the charge... {trollface})

Triglav,
Actually, just increase the interruption ability and It'll be good. MAYBE increase the chance of freeze on swing...

~Tsu

Lun, 04/02/2012 - 13:24

#21

Akarahn

I like the suggestions, Tsu.

I like the suggestions, Tsu. The strong swords that have a status always seem to have it on the 2nd swing. Case and point, the GF has curse, Triglav has freeze, and while the DA doesn't have a status it launches beastmode charges. Suda is a little lacking in the practical combat area considering these factors. No 2nd swing status infliction, and a charge that you have to put yourself in danger to use and not be guaranteed the status effect.

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Sudaruska/Triglav