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Weather Conditions

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Dom, 07/29/2012 - 12:01
Imagen de Jeff-Whittington
Jeff-Whittington

Sunshine, Nightfall, Snow, Rain.

These 4 weather conditions are caused by certain weapon charge attacks, or just occur naturally. Usually, a weapon that causes a weather condition will not benefit from that specific weather condition.

Weather conditions do not appear in Lockdown, and will not be a balancing issue there since they will not exist in PvP; only in the clockworks or missions.

***Sunshine***

Sunshine's visual effect looks similar to when you are in Haven: In the top middle to top left corner of your screen, there will be beams of orange light.

Sunshine is caused by Sudaruska's charge attack and has a duration of 30 seconds.

Sunshine increases weapon and monster chance to cause fire to 130%, and reduces weapon and monster chance to cause freeze to 70%.
*****Here is an example of what I mean. Furious Flamberge has a 1 in 16 chance to cause fire. In sunshine, it now has a 1.3 in 16 chance to cause fire. I don't mean "30% extra", I mean "130% of the original chance" or "70% of the original chance".

Special Effects: Valkyrie Armor's negative fire resistance is not in effect in sunshine, reducing fire's strength against it and keeping the "holy" armor (holy = sunshine) aspect to it.

***Snow***

Snow's visual effect is comparable to that of freeze-themed levels in the clockworks.

Snow is caused by Triglav's charge attack and has a duration of 30 seconds. This is the only weapon that benefits from its own weather condition.

Snow increases weapon and monster chance to cause freeze to 130%, and reduces weapon and monster chance to cause fire to 70%.

***Nightfall***

I am not sure what Nightfall's visual effect would look like or what I should compare it to.

Nightfall is caused by Graviton Vortex and has a duration of 30 seconds.

Nightfall increases weapon and monster chance to cause curse, self-inflicted curse, and sleep to 130% and has no negative effect.

Special effects: Gran Faust's charge time becomes comparable to Divine Avenger's. Divine Avenger's charge time becomes comparable to Gran Faust's. Chaos Armor's negative poison, freeze, and curse resistance becomes positive poison, freeze, and curse resistance in Nightfall.

***Rain***

Rain's visual effect is comparable to the effect created by the sprinkler system in the new recruit missions with Rhendon.

Rain is caused by Neutralizer's charge attack and has a duration of 30 seconds.

Rain increases weapon and monster chance to cause shock to 130%, and reduces weapon and monster chance to cause poison to 70%.

Special effects: Leviathan Blade will truly rain down upon its foes like the water from a tidal wave as its description says, slightly increasing its charge attack's range.

_

Weather conditions may also occur naturally in the clockworks or in missions. These weather effects cannot be altered or changed if they occur naturally.

One weather condition can replace another if the weather condition did not occur naturally.

Weather conditions cannot be caused by these weapon charge attacks unless the player is holding a Weather Stone trinket.

Weather Stone, 5 star trinket. Description: "Allows the player to cause weather conditions with certain weapons while in the clockworks or on a mission." There will also be added flavor text, I am not good at creating flavor text.

_

Real life reasoning behind some of the effects:

1. Sunshine = heat = should make it more difficult to freeze things. Sunshine can cause droughts, which can lead to fire.

2. Snow appears in cold weather conditions, and in cold weather conditions, things freeze easier. Snow significantly reduces wildfires.

3. Nightfall. Witches in real life likely prefer the night time to cast their dark magics = more curse? No true need for a negative effect.

4. Rain = water = a good conductor = shock. No, rain does not help get rid of fires. There should NOT be a reduced chance of fire effect, since rain and floods tend to cause wild fires due to the shock factor and we already have a negative fire effect from snow :). Rain also spreads disease, so a reduced chance of poison is illogical. Regardless, think of rain washing away poisons? Err....

_

In game reasoning for these effects:

1. Sudaruska and Triglav currently are great for their charge attack. They are both slower and deal less neutral damage than GF and DA with normal attacks, but I think this could be made up without damage buffs. A weather condition that can be useful utility-wise will help balance them.

2. Graviton Vortex is not nearly as useful as Electron Vortex due to Electron's chance to shock and cancel knockback as these weapons are used for utility and not damage. Graviton Vortex causing Nightfall and increasing the chance to cause curse can be a great added effect to gather up monsters with a Graviton then have a teammate unleash a GF charge attack inside of the cluttered group of monsters sucked in.

3. Neutralizer is just Neutralizer, 80% of Spiral Knights are unaware of its existance...... (80% is accurate, forum goers / wiki users are the minority of this game). It deserves something cool. It looks blue, and blue = water, so rain -.- sorry, not much of an explanation RP-wise here.

4. These should not be overpowered. Look at my example earlier, in Sunshine a Furious Flamberge will rise from a 1 in 16 chance to fire to a 1.3 in 16 chance to cause fire. 130% of its original chance, not 30% added chance. It will make only a slight difference, although it may help very much defensive-wise against certain status themed monsters while being a hindrance against other status themed monsters. Keep in mind that some of these status themed stratums, like freeze-themed levels, tend to already have a natural occuring weather condition which cannot be replaced.

They also demand an entire trinket slot to be used for the Weather Stone trinket.

Thanks if you read this ^w^

Dom, 07/29/2012 - 12:16
#1
Imagen de Jeff-Whittington
Jeff-Whittington
NOTE: I have edited the main

NOTE: I have edited the main post adding and changing certain things around. You may have to refresh the page for the full read.

Dom, 07/29/2012 - 13:41
#2
Imagen de Little-Juances
Little-Juances
~

Those things are ridiculously overpowered and dont really make sense.

Besides clockworks are artificial, controlled 'bio-domes'.

Dom, 07/29/2012 - 13:48
#3
Imagen de Jeff-Whittington
Jeff-Whittington
Please explain how they are

Please explain how they are ridiculously overpowered, do you have reasoning to back that up? Note the difference between "30% chance" and "130% of the original" chance.

Regardless, there is snow in certain freeze-themed levels in the arcade, showing that weather conditions do exist.

Dom, 07/29/2012 - 20:32
#4
Imagen de Oatmonster
Oatmonster
Lick

This is ridiculously OP.

Weather conditions do exist but not in the way you describe them.

There are almost NEVER freeze and fire themed monsters in the same area. Bring sunshine to a freeze stratum. Everything now burns and you don't freeze. Bring snow to a fire stratum. You are now flame retardant and monsters are frozen.

30% is a lot more than you think. A low defense UV is equivalent to about 10%. Yay, now everyone has a high status resistance whenever they use a certain charge attack

One big issue is that all of those charge attacks can be charged and executed in less than 30 seconds. just have one person use that charge and you have that "condition" forever.

I don't think you have seen a catalyzer charge attack. It is pretty much it's primary attack, especially in PVE. Just spam it in a poison stratum. Boom, instant poison resist.

What if you just spammed the Suda charge in a freeze stratum? I have never seen any monsters that cause fire in a freeze stratum and you certainly don't need to be freezing freeze themed monsters. And there you have it, instant freeze resistance for the whole party.

Nightfall, you have one party member spam GV and everyone wears chaos. You now have a party with +2 universal damage each and +2 universal CTR each, not to mention med status resist to all the common statuses.

Dom, 07/29/2012 - 20:58
#5
Imagen de Dukeplatypus
Dukeplatypus
The only level, or at least

The only level, or at least the only I can think of, where you would face both freeze and fire is that one beast mission where you fight all the status varieties of Chromalisks.

Lun, 07/30/2012 - 02:17
#6
Imagen de Forumchat
Forumchat
darn pokemon fanboy again...

darn pokemon fanboy again...

Lun, 07/30/2012 - 05:53
#7
Imagen de Fehzor
Fehzor
Pokemon much?

I actually kind of like this idea, although I'd prefer these conditions be put onto bombs; it would help fix the underlying problem with bombs- their support is inferior to having another sword/gun wielding player most of the time, and their only real focus is on multiple monsters.

So what I would prefer would be something like the following:

-Movement slowed when charging; charge time should be similar to allow the bomber to take advantage of his other bombs while using a weather effect.
-About the same charge time as BAB
-"weather" is similar to a gremlin healing circle; it has a radius around the bomb, and the effects take place within that. The circle is shown on the ground, and the weather comes down onto it
-Radius of weather condition is larger than most bombs; increases with star level of bomb. 2* radius should be about the 75% the size of nitronome's radius, and the 5* radius should be about 1.5 times nitronome's radius.
-Duration of weather condition starts at about 15 seconds per a 2* bomb, and goes up to about a minute and a half per 5* bomb
-Your weather effects could do with some tweaks as well, but I won't list them :)

So kind of like a "weather machine" type of bomb, if you will.

The problem with it being applied to existing charges is, as someone above said, that the items are already balanced roughly with each other, and weather effects would be huge buffs... imagine that everyone used chaos cloak with graviton vortex and gran faust. Weather conditions are one of the largest and most successful tactics in pokemon, and they could easily overwhelm the current balance in spiral knights, though it is possible that they could be applied to already bad weapons, like h.decon (though it would make little sense in most cases).

Lun, 07/30/2012 - 07:55
#8
Imagen de Selenium
Selenium
If sunshine boosts Valkyrie armor...

... does it mess with Undead/Skelly lines/shadow things in general? Also, do shadow things in general have a boost at night?

Mié, 08/01/2012 - 12:14
#9
Imagen de Zeddy
Zeddy
Merp

Chaos Armor's negative poison, freeze, and curse resistance becomes positive poison, freeze, and curse resistance in Nightfall.

This is why they're ridiculously OP. You can turn a risk/reward armour into a reward/reward armour by just planting a Graviton every 30 seconds.

Furthermore, having the weather change every half a minute would get old (read: annoying) pretty quick.

Mié, 08/01/2012 - 12:17
#10
Imagen de Asukalan
Asukalan
Yeah, weather condition, like

Yeah, weather condition, like if SK is not enough laggy and hardware demanding right now without those.

Mié, 08/01/2012 - 12:33
#11
Imagen de Bella-Donna
Bella-Donna
Why not just visual

Weather shouldn't have an effect on game play, just having it as a visual thing would be nice though.

Weapons shouldn't cause weather, but weather could be random for a level but could be nice to just see.

Mié, 08/01/2012 - 12:52
#12
Imagen de Luguiru
Luguiru
Dem stratums

Status based stratums already have weather.

Go through the Clockworks via Arcade.

Mié, 08/01/2012 - 13:27
#13
Imagen de Zeddy
Zeddy
How about some moderation?

Actually, if we remove the completely redonkulous stuff like turning armour penalties into armour buffs, I think it'd be cool for weather to have an effect on various statuses and damage types. No need for weapons that can actually cause weather to happen, though. Maybe rare weather vials?

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