Where is the challenge these days? Seriously nothing is hard any more. I miss the days when wolvers followed you while in attack mode, zombies no longer jump at you and suck your brains out. I miss the insane annoyance of devilites! I'm sure silkwings were nerfed as well. Even now that I have mastered how to deal with glop drops they are easy also. SL is a piece of cake. Elite mode just adds more hp to monsters. I'm bored now, everything is too baby stuff easy.
OOO why you no make things challenging?
dim, 03/30/2014 - 09:23
dim, 03/30/2014 - 09:33
#2
I have no mouth and I need to scream
knyack knyack knyack
MotT was actually fair. It's just so many of the daderps chose the wrong pulsar gun/didn't have a pulsar gun/didn't bring a gun.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 09:44
#3
Llama to Victory!
Hard is such a subjective term.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 09:47
#4
@ Skepticraven
Save it, screen shot it, bookmark it, favourite this suka. Ain't never gonna hear me complain of difficulty.
Those weren't easy, but they weren't hard either. A good team and you are sorted. If OOO want to focus on team gameplay, monsters don't need more hp or hit harder. They need clever AI. Reverting things back to how they were before all the nerfs is the solution. Or.....maybe OOO intends to add tougher enemies in later that makes our current stock of monsters look like a joke?
lun, 03/31/2014 - 07:19
#5
Hehehe
You want a challenging mission ? So hard you can rage ? Try playing Danger mission, Grinchlin assult and Shadow Lair on elite with.....a computer that contain 1 GB Ram...I swear thay you would cry...
dim, 03/30/2014 - 10:14
#6
I'd like to just say this here and say there's a line between "you need to think to win" and "you can't do this without taking damage".
Having to do the same thing every time to solve a problem isn't entertaining, especially when the solution is straight out of kindergarten- move half a tile to the side when a Wolver or Skelly swipes at you, yay you dodged! And yet, problems with no realistic solutions aren't fun either.
The last room in G.A. from Winterfest, for example. It's practically impossible to dodge, because there are so many high-range/high-speed attacks being thrown at you, and you can only dash and shield so much at one time..
Compare this to the 2-tortodrone fight with the Devilites thrown in pretty much forces you to use a gun or bomb. There's almost no room to use a sword.
Tortodrones are fairly quick and have nasty range for a melee enemy, their ground-slam shockwave being difficult to telegraph once it's fired, as well. Unless you have your dash up and you're willing to burn it, you're taking a huge risk. Tortos with Devilites pretty much means you can only use the fastest or most movement-friendly swords (Hammer).
But you can use ranged attacks from guns and bombs. You can win that fight by skill alone. That's what sets it apart from something like G.A. where you can't just be good, you need to be good and have good gear at the same time.
Though I still think Tortodrones could use a little tweaking, like making the ground-slam easier to see (like being a steadily moving ring as opposed to one that stutters while the hitbox is slightly different) and giving some means to escape if they trap you in a corner, they've got a much 'healthier' kind of difficulty.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 10:35
#7
Blech...
You've never tried doing Apocrea on Elite by yourself?
dim, 03/30/2014 - 11:20
#8
@OP
Those weren't easy, but they weren't hard either. A good team and you are sorted."'
Well there is the clincher right there: a good team. If you want difficulty go around and solo or play with lower tier gear. You'll be whistling a different tune soon enough. Entertain yourself and you'll quickly find that when you're doing all the muscle it's not as easy. Granted soloing makes monsters slightly weaker, but that's where sheer numbers come in.
"Where is the challenge these days?"
You'll need to wait to see how this works out one of "these days". It involves teamwork so it should do you nicely.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 11:28
#9
replies
@ Phantomhamachi: unfortunately no.
@ Purepwn: I would actually say that soloing is far more easier. Only because it seem to take less damage when soloing.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 11:34
#10
Here's a challenge for
Here's a challenge for you...
Find GM Atalanta somewhere in Haven. You have 10 minutes. Go!
dim, 03/30/2014 - 11:46
#11
@OP
I'm not sure how you can say soloing is easier in general when you haven't even tried Phantomhamachi's scenario, in which soloing is virtually a death wish. Even if you don't prefer to solo, removing your gear advantage is a still a place to start making things more difficult. In either case, I think you need to define "easy". For me, easy means not having to spark or in some cases not using emergency revives.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 11:44
#12
@Atlanata
I didn't catch you! Could you extend the event by say, three days?
dim, 03/30/2014 - 11:47
#13
Nope!
Nupe!
Tell ya what, I'll stick to my hiding place for another hour or two but I'll still be visible to the player eye.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 12:15
#14
I'M COMING FOR YOU! Which Haven I do wonder, though... Gonna guess English Havens, at least.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 12:43
#16
dim, 03/30/2014 - 12:51
#17
You want some challenge?
Ok, let me think here. Hmm... Ah! I know!
How about an event mission that forces you to use Proto gear. If you try to sneak in anything else, you get instantly booted back to Haven. You have to go in with a full party and if anyone leaves, everyone is sent to Haven.
Part 1: At first, you have to walk through tons of muck (slow snow) which is covered around every tile. This will make dodging extremely hard! While you are walking through this, instantly respawning Hyper Puppies that fire 8 rockets at once and a mortar are constantly attacking! This path will go on for 800 tiles. Once you reach the 400 mark, 50 Tortodrones will spawn with an endless supply of Darkfang menders to keep them alive at all times! Once you reach the 800 mark, you are forced to sacrifice 1 player to King Tinkenzar who will mind control the Knight into fighting for the Gremlins. This player's character will be removed and replaced with an extremely over powered Gremlin at the end of the mission.
Part 2: You ride an elevator down to the next floor. The first party button will be in a large room with nothing in it. The room will measure 50x50 tiles. When all the players step on the party button, every tile except the tiles making up the party button, is replaced with one of the above mention Hyper Puppies. To progress, the party must kill all of the Hyper Puppies. When ever one is killed, it erupts into a huge explosion that spews lava everywhere and one shots all nearby Knights! Once this part is done, King Tinkenzar returns to collect another sacrifice for his Gremlin army.
Part 3: While riding up the elevator, it breaks! The two remaining players must walk out and onto a completely random floor. It is more of a frame than an actual level. There are tons of gremlin Thwakers all over the place that have shields all over them and do nothing but instant, one shot, spin attacks! You also have to be careful. If you get pushed off the edge of the frames, you get cought by Tinkenzar and added to the Gremlin army! But it doesn't matter because at the end, a player is sacrificed to him anyways!
Part 4: Now for the boss battle! The single remaining player has to fight against their 3 Gremlinified friends. They have all of their gear equipped at once meaning that the better prepared the player, the harder the Gremlin version. This wouldn't have mattered at first because you were stuck in Proto. It is a simple fight against these three Gremlins. But if the last player runs out of sparks and energy to revive, they are also Gremlinified and all 4 characters are deleted forever. If the player beats the Gremlins, everyone is reversed back to normal.
At the end of the fight, Rhendon appears out of no where, gives the surviving player a Valve Blitz Needle, then fly's away into the Core...
So, how do you like it? I'm sure it would make a great event!
dim, 03/30/2014 - 13:07
#18
“SMELLS LIKE HOME!”
dim, 03/30/2014 - 13:11
#19
↓
Atalanta decided to give out* so many radiants to everyone that found her, her banstick could only be heated to lvl 3.
*No radiants were actually given out.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 13:13
#20
You know Whim... I would love
You know Whim... I would love if an area in a MMO was named that. It would make me giggle uncontrollably. :D
~Gwen
dim, 03/30/2014 - 13:33
#21
Well that was fun.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 14:00
#22
@ Atalanta
Pas juste! Ok amende Spiral Knights est un jeu difficile. :)
Maintenant tout le monde qui ne comprend pas le français a besoin d'utiliser google translate comme je l'ai fait entrer cette. Hahaha
@ Purepwn forgive me for being too vague. Easy hmm...yes not using emergency revives/SoL, taking minimal/no damage, having the luxury to spin around and shout "RIGHT ROUND BABY ROUND RIGHT ROUND" any monster in the game.
I shall wait for the next Apocry event and solo it on elite!!! I shall take multiple screen shots of my *cough*death*cough* victory! :)
dim, 03/30/2014 - 13:57
#23
Now that's just mean you guys. Dark cub isn't THAT terrible of a person.
I think the game is a lot more difficult than it was when wolvers could trace you. At that point, we didn't have infinitely respawning grievers. Or any of the danger missions. The wolvers tracing the knight made more sense than them just bitint the air next to you, but its not such a huge thing.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 14:01
#24
@Fehzor
I think I remember when wolvers could trace after you... I also remember that after a blast cube blew up, the little red bomb orb things could stick to you if you touched them. That's why I don't walk near them.
dim, 03/30/2014 - 14:04
#25
@ Cinoa
They used to stick...tries to think that far back.....
*head hurts, shakes uncontrollably, vomits ferociously*
Sorry I can't remember.
@ Bamzalot I love it! Have a +1 and a AKD approved cookie!
lun, 03/31/2014 - 12:32
#26
I feel you AKD, I wish SL was
I feel you AKD, I wish SL was cheaper to get into so I could try to do it with silly weapons.
I did do Elite RT yesterday with just a Nitro. And it was by accident that I found out it was a little bit tricky to do because I didn't think much about the switches when I was started.
lun, 03/31/2014 - 19:33
#27
@ Cinoa I didn't like that implement because it was too Legend of Zelda-ish.
As for Wolvers, I really DO miss their old tracking attack, the one only dust bunnies and the Snarbolax have now.
I just REALLY REALLY REALLY want my big green cube, vog cub, badgers and last (And least) the golden trojan. Just to troll. Just to troll.
lun, 03/31/2014 - 23:14
#28
LOL! They just cant win
They make hard content the players bitch and moan and say its too hard. They nerf it and the the players bitch and moan saying its too easy(which it is). How bout this next time they come out with something hard why dont you just shut your trap and try to beat it as is instead of whining and saying its too hard please nerf. Then you dont have to worry about there not being any hard content.
lun, 03/31/2014 - 23:39
#29
@Phantomhamachi Apocrea on
@Phantomhamachi Apocrea on elite was easy as f. I instantly saw the attack patterns of the tentacles which resulted in me being able to actually stay point blank in range of Slende- I mean Apocrea. His tentacles tend to make a C shape (or reversed) form which is easily avoidable by dodging. Non the less, this event I found the most fun since it was really different.
@Purepwn Nick said that. He's no longer working for Three Rings though. Also soloing is in fact easier as your damage output increases dramatically. I am actually able to solo every SL (except for the clusterf*** RRT) because of this. Monsters are really weak. And like I said in the part above, Apocrea was really easy once you knew the attack pattern (which I figured out after just 1 mission). Just when tentacles are about to be unleashed on you shield up and await the C shape of tentacles that will appear, instantly when you get hit spam the dodging button like mad (because lag tends to return you to your original position) and you often get out easily making you able to sit point blank in front of him, even killing him though he will respawn.
@Bamzalot If this is the only way for the game to be challenging then I have news for you, we want long term stuff to become challenging, not short-term stuff like events.
@Fehzor Honestly the tracking on Wolvers that I miss have been put on a different type of monster (Gorgos and Dust Bunnies). So I guess there will be new monsters with different attack patterns.
I might come over as an elitist, though honestly I wish the elite difficulty option atleast was somewhat challenging... The only place where I can redeem the need for challenge is as always: PvP.
lun, 03/31/2014 - 23:42
#30
@Phantomhamachi Apocrea on
@Phantomhamachi Apocrea on elite was easy as f. I instantly saw the attack patterns of the tentacles which resulted in me being able to actually stay point blank in range of Slende- I mean Apocrea. His tentacles tend to make a C shape (or reversed) form which is easily avoidable by dodging. Non the less, this event I found the most fun since it was really different.
@Purepwn Nick said that. He's no longer working for Three Rings though. Also soloing is in fact easier as your damage output increases dramatically. I am actually able to solo every SL (except for the clusterf*** RRT) because of this. Monsters are really weak. And like I said in the part above, Apocrea was really easy once you knew the attack pattern (which I figured out after just 1 mission). Just when tentacles are about to be unleashed on you shield up and await the C shape of tentacles that will appear, instantly when you get hit spam the dodging button like mad (because lag tends to return you to your original position) and you often get out easily making you able to sit point blank in front of him, even killing him though he will respawn.
@Bamzalot If this is the only way for the game to be challenging then I have news for you, we want long term stuff to become challenging, not short-term stuff like events.
@Fehzor Honestly the tracking on Wolvers that I miss have been put on a different type of monster (Gorgos and Dust Bunnies). So I guess there will be new monsters with different attack patterns.
I might come over as an elitist, though honestly I wish the elite difficulty option atleast was somewhat challenging (Better AI, since if you are currently able to dodge or evade all damage, more HP and damage output on monsters won't make any difference at all, Devilites and Greavers are my favourite monsters btw)... The only place where I can redeem the need for challenge is as always: PvP.
lun, 03/31/2014 - 23:41
#31
You are experiencing a PICNIC ERROR!
EDIT: derp wrong page
mar, 04/01/2014 - 00:52
#32
@ Deadagainalready
Who are you referring to? I haven't moaned once. Even before all the nerf or nothings, I didn't find the game hard, so you have never seen me moan once. As for the other guys posting here, I can't recall ever seeing any of them moan about difficulty before. You're venting right? April fool?
@ The-Dragon-Child; awesome tips on the Apocry event. I'll use that next time. Tbh even pvp became dull. 90% of all my matches on the eu server I used to get top damage. Granted I never got damage scores in the 30k+ but I believe my score ranged from 19k-25k on average, that's with no max UVs, no max damage. All I'm saying is I've played against some of this games greatest and out damaged them on occasions. In pvp no one cares if you win or lose, the mentality was to out damage everyone else. It was like that when I used to play anyway.
I know how serious some of you are at LD, so this isn't a challenge. I am probably completely rubbish now. Haven't touched pvp for a good year. Never will.
mar, 04/01/2014 - 03:55
#33
@The-Dragon-Child
I can fix that problem. Why just have it be an event when it can instead be a permanent boss!?
As a bonus reward to winning, the single surviving player can get 500,000,000 crowns, 100,000,000 energy, and unlimited Prismatic Bolted Vees! This would cause a lot more players to try thier luck here instead of FSC. Also, you would need to complete this mission to get to the totally new Tiers 4-16 and use all the new stared gear!
(By the way, I was joking from the start. I can't believe you didn't notice.)
mar, 04/01/2014 - 05:10
#34
If you want a challenge
Turn on AT with a shard bomb I heard it's really hard to use.
mar, 04/01/2014 - 07:55
#35
@The-Dragon-Child
"Nick said that. He's no longer working for Three Rings though."
Yes, but if you read the quote carefully, and I hope you have, he said "we're working" implying more than one person. Just because Nick is gone by no means confirms that the plans he announced, especially the gunner update, has been cast aside. It doesn't really matter who announced it at this point.
"Also soloing is in fact easier as your damage output increases dramatically."
I already admitted to this somewhat. Saying: "Granted soloing makes monsters slightly weaker, but that's where sheer numbers come in" Quite frankly, while I won't question your skill, I don't think you speak for the general player populace who from my view usually avoid soloing. There is a reason most people prefer to party, especially in Shadow Lairs, Danger Missions, Event Missions, and even your basic Boss runs. It's because the latter is either too tedious, or overwhelming even moreso many players don't have the luxury to buy a Shadow Key just for themselves. Players aren't usually capable of confidently soloing until they get a well rounded, or maybe several 5* loadouts. If soloing was truly easier, then everyone would do it and party play would be borderline pointless. This is not the case and therefore soloing is still arguably more difficult depending on the player, and you're just one of several exceptions out of a large community.
I definitely agree on the AI sentiment. It's awkward to be stuck in a room only to find it was a Zombie or Lichen stuck walking towards a corner.
*Makes a note of the node number for when the next apocrea-grinchlin-tortodrone style SoL sink appears and people start complaining again for being too difficult*