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Hall of Heroes: All vendors should only sell one set

17 replies [Last post]
Thu, 10/03/2013 - 18:32
Skyguarder's picture
Skyguarder

Similar to:
http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/90377

Lots of people would like to get rid of the Hall of Heroes. However, I don't like the point where the Hall of Heroes is taken out entirely and I disagree. I've commented on the thread about what we should do to the Hall of Heroes, but I don't think it's receiving enough attention. So I've come up with an idea where each vendor sells ONLY ONE set.

==========

Echo

*Echo should only sell the following: Skolver Set, Iceburst Brandish line, cutter line, swiftstrike buckler, flourish line

Daxen

*Remove the following recipe lines from Daxen: Alchemers with a status effect

Remi

*Make Remi only sell the Bombtastic Demo set, Nitronome and mist bombs.
Archilus

*Make Archilus sell the Divine Mantle line / set and the owlite shield line ONLY.

Sylvin

*N/A

Walkon

*N/A

Zebulon

*Zebulon should only sell the Deadly Virulisk Set / line, Omega Shield and the Drake Scale Shield.

Izola

*Izola should only sell the Ironmight Plate set / line and Ironmight Plate Shield

Jorin

*Why the heck is Jorin in the Hall of Heroes? Why is he selling the cobalt line / set when you could get them from missions? In my opinion, Jorin should be removed from the Hall of Heroes.

*If the first option doesn't work, just remove the Cobalt line from Jorin. Vitasuit deluxe will be sold by Jorin.

==========

I'm not sure if this would be a good idea to balance the Hall of Heroes.

Criticism, but no insults please.

Thu, 10/03/2013 - 18:35
#1
Arkate's picture
Arkate
...

The fact that Skolver will have become so much rarer than Vog all of a sudden will make it so much more expensive. And I see nothing wrong in Izola selling the Volcanic plate set. Jorin is there, because he sells the recipe for Azure guardian and I believe Alimirian crusader.

Thu, 10/03/2013 - 18:42
#2
Zerokken's picture
Zerokken
-1 for now.

No. Echo isn't supposed to be using Vog Cub. Skolver continues the main attracting factor of the Wolver line, and he's already using a Swiftstrike Buckler + DVS. The gear he's equipping gives a very good example of what you should use.

You're taking away too much, and really, Why would you cut off their sales of the main armor line? (Grey Feather, Skolver, Et Cetera) And for Zebulon, why would you cut off Zebulon's gear? (>States his gear is alot of situational gear, why should he only have slime bonus gear for sale?)

Also, the Almirian Crusader set is Shadow Lair armor.

Also also, I agree with the Daxen modifications. That's about the only one I really agree with, though.

Thu, 10/03/2013 - 19:03
#3
Little-Juances's picture
Little-Juances

From all 3 standard demo lines, you had to choose mad bomber?

Thu, 10/03/2013 - 19:29
#4
Arkate's picture
Arkate
I must agree with Juances.

I must agree with Juances. Giving the dedicated bombers the Mad Bomber set as the primarily sold one is like spitting on the sole of your boot, then smashing them into the ground with it.

Thu, 10/03/2013 - 19:38
#5
Usevnsevnsixfivfor's picture
Usevnsevnsixfivfor

@OP

I bet you abuse the HoH like the rest of us.

"Criticism, but no insults please."

Welcome to the internet, where you will be praised for doing wrong and persicuted for choosing your standerds. Insults guarenteed 100% of the time, no exceptions.

Thu, 10/03/2013 - 21:15
#6
Toeni-Sevan's picture
Toeni-Sevan
Thanks Skyguarder for the link!

I like the idea and changed my stance to it, but I will disagree like the others on what sets should be defaulted on each NPC. I have my own opinion, which can be disagreed upon on what the "default" or original line for each armor is.

Echo: Keep Skolver in, because the wolver line is piercing and freeze all the way up until that we should consider it the default line.
Daxen: Not a bad idea sir.
Remi: I can not support the madness. Do Volcanic since it keeps the CTR that it's predecessors down the line had.
Archilus: Make it Grey Feather, Divine is a specialty set, and the Hood itself is even more so with it's Fiend Med. Grey Feather keeps the nature of the magic line up until that point.
Sylvin: PLEASE keep him. Skelly is the classic Shadow Defence line up until the end game.
Walkon: Yeah.
Zebulon: I think Zebulon's items are considered a specialty, get rid of him.
Izola: I agree.
Jorin: He's fired.

Fri, 10/04/2013 - 06:11
#7
Thunder-The-Bright's picture
Thunder-The-Bright

could you just wait till arcade revamp? we don't know how recipies will be distributed with the new arcade, so we won't know if this will be viable or not.
arkate, I call orbital facepalm on the final part on your post #1.

Fri, 10/04/2013 - 06:16
#8
Arkate's picture
Arkate
@Thunder

Yeah...sorry about that. But I do know he sells the azure guardian recipe, which I believe can only be obtained that way.

Fri, 10/04/2013 - 06:30
#9
Thunder-The-Bright's picture
Thunder-The-Bright

rank missions?

Fri, 10/04/2013 - 09:43
#10
Mickmane's picture
Mickmane
No.

The only players benefiting from HoH partially or completely gone are those re-selling recipes found only at Clockwork Basil.

It would mean a frustating game of chance, being forced to run through levels to get there time and again just to get something essential to progress in the game, or be forced to waste resources on something they don't want.

So, basically you want a few player's pockets filled at the expense of the enjoyment of the game of a lot of other players.

There IS nothing TO balance.

This is not a trade game. Trade being an option is a curtesy by the developers so someone's surplus that would otherwise have no use may benefit someone else's need. I seriously doubt anything in the game is meant to make players rich.

(I've made Millions with Recipes, starting only a bit after HoH came to the game. I call it my service to the lazy; those too lazy to go to HoH or read wiki on where to get Recipes for normal price. It's my main source of income to finance Divine Valk Wings and Bitter Shield and stuff like that. I would rather have all Basil disappear from the game than Hall of Heroes clipped in any way. It would turn me from moderately wealthy to poor guy who needs to slay monsters for Crowns. Keeping HoH as it is or even selling all non-SL/Krogmo Recipes there would be worth that!)

Fri, 10/04/2013 - 10:07
#11
Khamsin's picture
Khamsin
@Mickmane

Nailed it. Thread over. Discussion over. Don't make this thread again.

Fri, 10/04/2013 - 10:39
#12
Battlegrinder's picture
Battlegrinder
How do you kill a topic that won't die?

I acknowledge that the HoH had a significant shift on the game's economy and metagame, however the HoH didn't kill the arcade, and trying to kill the HoH won't bring the arcade back. And honestly, I don't think the arcade needs much help. I've been seeing a lot more people doing arcade runs since the sprite update, and the current toxic blizzard is probably the only reason the arcade isn't more popular. Plus the arcade is going to get a retool in the next update too.

The real reason the arcade isn't as popular as it once was is the missions (and the missions are staying, so don't bother suggesting that they be removed). And if people like grinding their way through the same mission over and over again, why stop them? If that's the way they prefer to play, so be it.

Limiting the HoH's inventory isn't a good idea, because it will stagnate the metagame even more. Limiting the recipes available at the HoH will lead to most people just crafting those, instead of going into the clockworks. Sure, some will, but for the most part we'll see an explosion of the HoH line and nothing more. Especially not for Zebulon and Izola. Their recipes are already barely used, and removing most of their inventory will kill off those sets completely.

And finally, as Mickmane said: Merchants will benefit from this change, and no one else. And while I'm a big fan of capitalism, at some point you have to step in and protect people from exploitation.

1. Going from "infinite number of recipes" to "smaller number of more expensive recipes" is not an improvement.
2. Even if the overall supply increases, the variety will not. If you want a niche or unpopular item (scarlet shield, Magnus, cautery sword), good luck. Merchants want rapid sales, and stocking up on low demand weapons won't do that.
3. The current system is one of the game's main crown sinks, and changing that to a system to funnel money into the pockets of merchants is probably not a good idea.

Fri, 10/04/2013 - 13:49
#13
Toeni-Sevan's picture
Toeni-Sevan
I can honestly say that both for and against are pretty equal.

I honestly don't know what to think until the arcade gets revamped.
See you in a half a year or so guys.

Sun, 10/06/2013 - 11:00
#14
Wavara's picture
Wavara

There's a problem with Jorin: He is the only one to sell the recipes of the Cobalt set (2*) and the Defender(2*). Unless you want to pay 15K for a 2* set (via Greave), those recipes should be relocated on someone else.

Sun, 10/06/2013 - 11:05
#15
Little-Juances's picture
Little-Juances

Cobalt sets are gifts from missions. No one buys them from vendors.

Should only be made unsellable or auto-learn them after doing the respective missions to prevent accidental selling.

Sun, 10/06/2013 - 11:36
#16
Skyguarder's picture
Skyguarder

I thought that Remi was a Mad Bomber, but I've saw that he was in another set.

Sun, 10/06/2013 - 12:56
#17
Battlegrinder's picture
Battlegrinder
@Little-Juances

If you want to craft more than one of the cobalt-line items and get the alternate gear (Heater, Almirian Crusader, CIV, BAB, ect) you'll need to buy a copy of the 2* recipes.

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