Thanks for responding! Now that you mention it, I guess carrying over the Lockdown equipment as-is would probably cause a mess of things.

For the Recon Cloak to be more balanced, enemies would likely have to have higher intelligence. Like Lockdown players often do, monsters would probably respond to being hit by a recon mark. Maybe if there were a bunch of enemies, like a bunch of gremlins for example, they would spread out and search for the Recon Specialist if they weren't already focusing on other players. Alternatively (or additionally), enemies would need to be more complicated in terms of their defense mechanisms, as you stated. Upon receiving a death mark, possibilities for enemies could include making them briefly weak to all damage types or (for enemies like trojans, Darkfang thwackers, and maybe drones) negating shields and invulnerabilities. Another way to balance the Cloak might just be to make its duration extremely limited.

As for the Guardian Shield, healing is definitely a no-go. When I was writing down my idea, I had completely forgotten that Guardians healed at all, so thanks for pointing it out. I still think it would be fun and interesting to have Guardians be the sole source of defense for an entire party. Like I said, Class Missions would involve tougher enemies, so I don't think the shield itself would be too imbalanced in terms of its defense stats. Moreover, it looks to be a 5* shield, so in lower tiers it would be nerfed to some extent (correct me if I'm wrong).

Finally, Strikers. You're pretty much completely right about how BTS/Swiftstrike kind of render the Striker class worthless. I think my only rebuttal would be that in the Class Mission environment you wouldn't be able to take a BTS/Swiftstrike with you, therein lying the beauty of the Class Mission system. It offers a different style of play for the PvE scene, one that encourages (but doesn't require) team play. Lockdown equipment in PvE (specifically Guardian/Striker) would create an interesting way to split up attack and defense duties.

Even if a Class Mission were implemented, players would by no means be required to use it, so you could still use a BTS/Swiftstrike in regular PvE levels. I guess like you said, players can usually dodge most attacks, but the ability to completely forfeit a shield for increased move speed and the buffs similar to BTS/Swiftstrike might be more fun for some people, especially for those who enjoy running solo.

Again, the idea is an underdeveloped one, so feedback is appreciated.

As implied by the name, Class Missions would fall under the existing Mission System. So I guess what I'm imagining for these Class Missions is a scenario-oriented PvE environment, as Agentalbedo said. I think level structure would probably be limited to tight passages and very large rooms (perhaps the size of an Explosive Blocks Danger Room) in order to avoid forming large mobs for Recon to Death Mark all in one go. As for tight passages, imagine a blood vessel. Recon would be able to maybe get around and mark a "clot" of enemies, and the next clot would be far enough away that Guardian and Striker would still have to fight each clot individually.

My theory for large rooms is that they're large enough that in order for all of the enemies to get really clumped up, parties would have to circle around the room several times. In other words, a big, tight mob would be possible, but there might not be much of an advantage in terms of the time it takes to clear the room. It's important to note that players in a Class Mission would be unable to shield-bash enemies (except maybe Guardian thoughe?), so they would have to rely on their weapons' knockback capabilities if they wanted to quickly form clumps of enemies.

I think a valid strategy for a Recon/Striker team in a large room would be for Recon to mark small, scattered groups of enemies and for Striker to utilize its movement speed increase to take out those groups one by one. Again this kind of shows the advantage of running with a party in Class Missions.

Going off of Agentalbedo's idea of a fast-paced, high-intensity level, how's this for a possibility: rescuing a stranded Spiral Crew member from a secret sector of the Ironclaw Munitions Factory. First off, the level(s) would have a timer (which could be included in the scenario as a self-destruct sequence or something). The timer would have to be generous enough to allow for a variety of equipment to be used to effectively complete the mission, but restricting enough that parties would be highly encouraged to use the Recon and Striker classes as specified above. Second, the Crew member would have a finite amount of health, and must be alive by the end of the mission. Given the explosive-filled environment of IMF, Guardian would play a huge role in protecting party members and the Crew member.

In this example especially, I feel like Recon would be a balanced part of a full party. Recon wouldn't as easily be able to escape harm by dodging enemies because there's still explosive danger from the environment (and from gremlin bombs maybe). At the same time, Recon would be useful in helping to clear out enemies quickly for the sake of the timer. Another thing I realized about Recon is that the ability to mark enemies would greatly enhance the crowd-control capabilities of a bomb-centered arsenal. Haze bombs and vortices could slow down and group enemies in order for the marks to be applied more effectively, and havoc ensues after that. This idea makes Recon a reasonable solo class as well.

Finally, Sev's idea about a frontal shield for Strikers. I kind of like the idea of a limited shield, but at the same time I kind of want to argue that Strikers' defense mechanism is the ability to run away quickly. Anyone else have thoughts on this part?

Two side notes:

• Wouldn't it be great if we could see shield health like Guardians do in LD?
• Sorry for having such looooong posts. The implementation specifics for a Class Mission system are turning out to be much more detailed than I initially imagined.

I was thinking about it and maybe another sort of sub-scenario using the Split Party Button idea within Class Mission levels would be to have Recon go step on a button in a room protected by a bunch of gun puppies while Guardian and Striker fight off a neverending stream of enemies in a large room. The room would open up for the party to proceed when the button is pressed, and monsters would stop spawning (the spawns would just disappear as they do in the last part of IMF). After thinking about it some more, I realized that this scenario seemed kind of biased toward Recon, but also that other classes would be able to go push the button just as easily. Striker could zoom past the gun puppies and maybe dodge a bit, and Guardian would be able to sort of "tank" them.

I actually feel like this scenario might be a little gimmicky, but nonetheless it is an example of teamwork-centric play in Class Missions through the use of a Split Party Button. Maybe people have other ideas for Class Mission scenarios?

I guess since my existing Class Mission idea is already very scenario-dependent, there's no reason why there shouldn't also be scenarios that each focus on a specific class. This sort of goes with what Sev said in his first post, regarding missions for testing out Lockdown gear in PvE, and with what I was saying in the original post about "training wheels". Personally, I think the idea of the stealth mission you outlined is great.

Thank you all for the support and feedback. I've updated the original post to make the Class Mission concept a little more tangible.

After playing around with missions for a bit, I'm feeling more and more like Class Missions could really be a thing. Missions seem to be very scenario-oriented (as should be expected, I guess), and the Class Mission scenarios we've come up so far with could probably fit right in. Of course, more scenarios that illustrate the idea of a Class Mission would be awesome.

EDIT: I also threw in a link to Cactuscat's thread about back accessories.

I really appreciate it, Fourtarkus!

Anyway, I've added the first piece of concept art to the original post, showing how Class Missions would fit into the existing Mission interface.

Anyone who knows the reference gets 3 (yes, three) cookies.

Anyway, I decided to overhaul the idea of a corrupt Alpha Squad and replace it with an adapted version of Just-Crusising's idea (The Betrayers) because I think it's a more fleshed-out concept. See the original post for my thoughts and proposed changes for this idea to fit Class Missions.

I earnestly think Class Missions could work in Spiral Knights. Are people not posting here because they don't want to read or because they don't agree with me? If anyone wants to shoot down this idea, give me your best shot.

...can anyone finish that off? If so, whoever does it gets a cookie.

Well, still not sure what to do with the Ghostmane Stalkers, but as I've been playing through missions I've been noticing more and more stuff like the scenarios we've come up with (I've only gone up to 8-2, so no spoilers please). All the more reason to adapt current missions to suit Class Missions.

I've been thinking about the whole Death Mark thing and I think there's basically two easy-to-implement solutions. The easiest would be simply to give enemies the same defense decrease that poison gives. The other way would be to create an equal but opposite effect to a Swarm Seed. I haven't played through any Shadow Lairs, but I know the Seeds provide a defense buff for enemies, so it shouldn't be too hard to make something that debuffs, right?

Changing the OP in a bit...maybe for the last time...

I'm terrible at making things more concise, but I'll try I guess?

Bumping this because the first few pages right now are lol-worthy...

Thanks for the details! I'll add/discuss your mission idea soon.

In the meantime, I just added a table of contents to the OP. I hope this makes it a little easier for people to navigate...

EDIT:
@Atrumvindex
Alright, discussion time! Sorry for this being a little late.

First off, I'm not so sure about the title "Furry Specters", since "furry" has a few...interesting connotations. I don't know if OOO would be able to use this because of copyright issues, but what about something classic like "Spy vs. Spy"?

Your description sounds pretty good, but I'm not entirely sure what you meant with the bargaining and the code of honor. On a side note, Ghostmane Stalkers' weapons bear something closer to a buzzsaw/circular saw, not a bandsaw. A bandsaw is literally a long band of sharp metal that is rotated to cut things whereas a buzzsaw/circular saw is more of a sharpened disk of metal. /nitpick

I really like the idea of fighting at depth 18 because it gives the scenario a lot more personality. I'm not sure whether the devs would allow this to happen, but it would be cool if they did.

As for the actual level design, I think it would be a little simpler if the Deconstruction Zone was a separate level, then Emberlight came after that. I don't think stun traps exist, so either the devs would have to create them or they would have to choose a different trap. I'm thinking poison would actually be somewhat appropriate, since it would sort of amplify the idea of a Death Mark. I can't say for sure because I've never fought them, but I think your idea of having Stalkers spark when marked is a good one.

I'll add your idea to the OP tomorrow when I have time, but in the meantime does anyone have thoughts?

@Atrumvindex
I finally got around to adding your scenario to the OP. I changed around some of the wording so that it made sense to me, but let me know if I misinterpreted anything.

@Evning
Thanks for the mention!
I'm not entirely sure if you wanted me to treat your excerpt as a scenario idea, but I guess there isn't really harm in doing so.

First things first, for the purposes of this thread I'm going to disregard the part about allies using the things you've donated for Prestige Missions. It's kind of a cool concept, it just doesn't really belong in this thread.

Moving on...
I like the idea of a big skirmish between knights and enemies, but I think the biggest issue I'm seeing is the amount of lag it would entail. If too many things moving around, there's going to be major lag issues. I assume this is why enemies currently come in waves. If allies/enemies had a set number of waves, I guess this would be okay (e.g. you get 5 waves of knight reinforcements to fight 15 waves of enemies). Another issue is that the current knights simply take too long to die. I guess I'm just thinking it wouldn't be too difficult to fight off a bunch of enemies while protecting the knights, unless there's really just THAT many enemies...

Hm...

That's an interesting concept, and it might be cool as a material sink, but I worry that this will give an advantage towards players who have either been playing the game for a long time or just have enough money to buy a lot of materials. I guess if you're a poorer player then you could still save up some materials for emergency healing in Class Missions, but still...

I've been thinking about it on and off for a while and I'm wondering whether the Guardian shield should be allowed a very slow rate of healing (maybe even slower than the heal pads in FSC). Like Agentalbedo said way back here, missions should be paced fast enough to prevent excessive healing, but there's still the problem of being able to just freeze enemies forever while healing.

Regarding the Guardian class, I always assumed that they would guard just as they do in Lockdown, meaning they follow the first pattern you outlined - each Guardian's shield takes damage for anything inside the bubble, and if there are multiple Guardians they each take the original amount of damage that would have been dealt (no stacking, no division). The only potential differences between a Class Mission Guardian Shield and a Lockdown one are outlined in the "potential modifications" section under the Guardian class in the OP. I guess I should probably state that a little more clearly - all classes should be essentially the same as their original Lockdown versions, besides the potential modifications.

As for your scenario, I feel like it could almost be its own type of mission. :P

The way I'm understanding your scenario is that your party is essentially reliving the Alpha Squad experience. Party members have crash landed on Cradle, and in order to fight they must make use of the armor/equipment on their backs and whatever weapons they find scattered in the remnants of the crash. They need to work together and adapt their strategy in order to survive.

I think this scenario would be really cool, but I'm not sure how the weapon boxes would work in terms of their programming. I guess that's up to the devs if they ever decide to include something like this, though.

Last note - thanks for contributing!

EDIT:
Derp. I should probably list what class is used in Single-class Missions...

I can see where you're coming from with the health bonuses/penalties. One of the biggest things that differentiates a Striker from a Guardian is his/her fragility. At the same time, though, there are other things that sort of add to this difference between those two classes - Strikers have no shield, and Guardians have a huge, tough one. No one ever said the defenses would be removed from the Guardian Shield, only adjusted. As-is, the Guardian Shield would be able to easily tank just about anything, so lowering its defense levels by some extent would make for a more balanced shield.

Healing equipment of any kind seems to be regarded as quite imbalanced because of its potential spamming. Like I said here, I'm personally starting to wonder if it could possibly work with a slow enough rate. There's always going to be the issue of freezing then healing forever, though.

As always, this is a forum, so everything is up for discussion. If I find that people can come up with strong reasoning to keep health bonuses/penalties or healing, I'll certainly change the OP to reflect that sentiment.

@Little-Cloud
You know, contrary to popular belief, I don't actually dedicate my life to the Spiral Knights Suggestions Forum. I'm a little busy now, so just hang tight, okay? If you want me to give you a serious response, you're going to have to wait. While I appreciate the free bumps, they're not going to help make me write up a proper reply any faster...