Spiral Knights - F2P players must go !!! The explanation of the problems of this game !!!

F2P players must go !!! The explanation of the problems of this game !!!

89 replies [Last post]

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 19:59

Zephyrgon

Hi guys. I'm Zephrygon and I would like to address this message above. F2P players must go. Sorry all of you F2p players, you have effectively ruined the whole game for all of us. But before I go into further detail, I will clarify a few things first.

The Two Types of People in SK: F2P and P2P

P2P:
Due to the fact that there are no monthly fees or anything in this game, these people should be clarified as Pay AS YOU GO players, but let's refer to them as P2P players. What are the prerequisites for being a P2P player? Well, it's simple: if you have by any means bought anything in this game, be it CE, expansion pack, a promo, you are a P2P player. Why? You pay as you go, you pay as you please. This is the only way you contribute in this game. It doesn't matter if you only put in $1 into this game: you go into this category. Also, if you are thinking about contributing, you are (kind of) part of the group.

F2P:
These people are the ones who do NOT contribute into the economy at all: they don't buy CE, promos, and all the other things. In short, they just generate crowns that everyone gets.

Now that I have successfully distinguished between the two types of players in the game, I will now explain how having a large F2P player base is actually harmful to this game. I would like to remind everyone of the good old days, when none of these promos existed, and the CE price was really low. NO, I wasn't there for BETA, but I was here on the month SK was released and ever since. We all know that everything went downhill when the ACCESSORY UPDATE came, when OOO decided to go corporate on us. WHY? I will explain.

When SK first started, it was small, the ratio between F2P and P2P was acceptable, so the CE prices were low (about 4k). However, due to the awesome updates, the F2P player base grew very large, and OOO decided to shower us with these very "wonderful" promos. Having players coming in and connecting is money, you know. So you can place the blame on the F2P base of why we have so many promos. Too many players, not enough payers.

Another thing, if you are expecting a super ginormous update from SK about the core opening or something, well your luck just ran out. Thanks to our large F2P player base, OOO will keep giving us these promos to compensate. They have to pay their employees too, you know, and they have to expand to accommodate this game. Expansion = money. How to get money? Hmmmm, how about giving the P2P players some promos and make them wait really long for some REAL updates. So now you can see how F2P players actually delayed the REAL updates that us P2P players want.

Now F2P players say that they DO contribute to this game, that they pump in crowns into our economy. Well, you are basically implying that us P2P players are on our butts doing nothing in game and loitering around. P2P players pump THE MOST into our economy since they buy elevator passes, CE and more, so they can do more runs. Crowns really aren't that important in game. So technically, we have more cons than pros when we view these F2P players.

Now guys, I know that many of you have really been hating on OOO for not giving us updates, but I just explained the problem here. If you are with me, tell these F2P players to go and leave us alone. Tell them to find and ruin some other game, but not our SK. You will see, if our F2P player base shrinks, our game will become better. Til' then, hope for the best. - Zephyrgon

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:10

Corrionos

Er...

Well.

Let me bring some opposing points to light.

1. Free to Play players are potential Pay to Play players, as you stated. So, if the entire F2P playerbase goes, OOO loses every single one of those potential payers. Also, most P2Ps start off as F2P, even if just to test the game.

2. Free to Play players provide at least some of the things P2Ps pay to get CE for. These things include ragecrafting, rare mineral drops, boss recipes, etc.

3. Eliminating the F2P playerbase would eliminate a lot of the popularity of this game, and thus potential money-making opportunities of OOO. Players that like the game talk about it, and encourage other people to try the game, since it's free. A paid game would be a bit harder to try.

...

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:19

Jmsa

...

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lwm9qaQsRW1qc9lhz.gif

Thanks for your seemingly troll thread.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:24

Jes-Turr

A game is meant to be played.

A game is meant to be played. No one's forcing you to keep playing, Zephyrgon. If you hate us F2P players so much, why don't you go?

After all, your entire post is about kicking out a bunch of players so that the small group that remains could supposedly enjoy the game more. What's the point? Spiral Knights is a free to play game to attract more people to play, it's against the notion that to have fun, you need to pay. To compensate, they do give you P2P players perks, instant CE, special costumes, access to test servers, that HAMMER @_@
TL;DR You, as a P2P player, do not get the right to enjoy the game exclusively to yourself.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:24

Pokenuevo

I don't think being f2p is all that bad

I just hate when f2p bash at p2p such as myself. Some of them think people who have spent money on this game have no skill whatsoever. It bugs me, but whatever. I just find it irritating when the f2p regard themselves like saints for not spending a dime. Although, the good people are what I like. The nice f2p players are a good way of keeping things going and nice to have.
I started f2p. I enjoyed the game. I got to the stage between 4* and 5*, had some extra money to spend. I decided I'd use it on my favorite game. For those who know the real me, I don't spend money at all. It's a rare case when I do. This game has got me to spend some bucks, but it's not like I go near the limits at all.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:34

Rommil

i say

we get rid of all the P2P players and all the free players. Then the game will be perfect.

edit:
furthermore, even if your flawed logic were correct rather than horribly flawed and unfounded, us telling them "they must go" would do no good whatsoever. They'd just tell you to go pound sand and get back to ruining the game.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:34

Aumir

Ralph says

No.

^
Speaking in same language so OP is able to understand :3

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:34

Pawn

This

This thread is ridiculous. Zeph you don't even make a poor argument. You have demonstrated no logical connection between f2p making accessories promos more common, or between this leading OOO to try and milk the promos instead of making the core. You have demonstrated nothing but an opinion based on your other opinions :/

BTW, the game would suck if all the f2p's were gone. I'm gonna log onto to spiral knights and see what the other 100 remaining players are doing. Just ridiculous.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 20:48

Canozo

+1 Rommil

What a brilliant idea.

*deletes Canozo*

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:00

Iron-Volvametal

...

*Creates an Account named "Canozo" & then Wreck Havoc over the Forum.*

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:00

#10

Kive

well youre an idiot

no offense, This game is categorized as FREE to play so not spending money is perfectly acceptable. CE prices have gone up because the PLAYER BASE increased making more of a demand for ce. OOO gives out promos to THANK ( cannot stress this enough) its players who pay to help keep this game running. How many FRICKIN times do GMs have to tell people that OOO works on multiple projects at the SAME time, a new accessories wouldnt take up all the devs time *facepalm*. Remember that OOO is a small dev team not some huge team like Blizard who can pump content out more consistently. Its not the free players fault at all its just changing times, get with the program bub.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:02

#11

Thissauceisboss

Zephyrgon =

Zephyrgon = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZK3ZGfRH98&feature=related

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:04

#12

Zephyrgon

Hahahaha

*FACE PALM

Troll thread my seemingly cute and deadly Virulisk butt. If you read, P2P players also include POTENTIAL payers, so please read the article CAREFULLY before you say that I'm trolling you. I've established every freaking connection there is: game needs to expand, OOO dishes out promos. DUH. I would rather have a small but great SK than this. You have to agree with me that right now, SK is not where it is supposed to be. I'm not saying that you should pay right away if you just started playing SK, hell it took me 3 months to actually start paying in little amounts. You guys have the flawed logic. It's funny really because I stopped caring about this game, and no one really would like to lend an ear. Should all F2P players go? BY ALL MEANS.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:08

#13

Iron-Volvametal

...

0/10

Would not Friend Zephyrgon

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:15

#14

Zephyrgon

Ya sure

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Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:25

#15

Dusklander

If all the F2P players left

If all the F2P players left there'd be less people to fill the slots in T1 lockdown, and I needs my T1 lockdown. Seriously, for the love of chicken salad sammiches, let's get some people in T1 lockdown. It'll make everyone happier.

Also, P2P players cause their own problems. When I throw down and buy CE, I'm bringing in lots of value into the economy suddenly, from nowhere that I can just spend like crazy. When lots of people do this, inflation rises and markets fluctuate like all over the place. And then, cause people are buying it, why not have another promo? I mean, can you blame them? Who doesn't want fistfuls of cash? Really, it's the -P2P- players that need to go!

...

But I'm not going anywhere.

...

Except maybe to T1 lockdown. It's a great place to vent some frustration.

...

Just sayin'...

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:45

#16

Psychodestroyer

.....

Suddenly...

I've gone from not caring who you were, to not liking you. Immensely.

Say whatever you want, the game's Play status is not for you to decide.

"You have to agree with me that right now, SK is not where it is supposed to be."

Pray tell, WHERE is SK supposed to be? Hm? Opening the Core, finding the power within it's depths, powering up the Skylark?

SK is barely a YEAR OLD. If you think it's so easy to come up with new content and other fecal matter without ending the game's reason for existence, write a story where your character is stuck on a different planet all alone, and continue it WITHOUT WRITING THE END.

You make it sound like OOO is such a small company, that they have all of their few developers working FURIOUSLY on programming things for the new CE promos they have no time for anything else.

Psh. OOO is a company. A business. And any professional business knows not to pool ALL their resources into a single project, unless it's absolutely MAJOR. And CE promos are not major.

Story games like SK take time to expand because they have to 1) Think of where it should go from here, including logical reasoning as to WHY this would occur, and also how to leave it open for future additions. 2) Think of what goes INTO the new story. That includes anything of names of new monsters, concept art for them, stats and balancing etc 3) The setting itself, ALSO with concept art etc.

Besides, kicking out a whole section of the playerbase would be a pretty [male genital]head move for the company's PR. With all your 'unflawed logic' I'm surprised you didn't add that to your reasoning.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:51

#17

Rommil

ahem

don't do what you cannot undo until you have considered what can't be done once it has been done. ~king shrewd

Anywho, i agree with your premise in regards to opening the core. But for heaven's sakes, the lack of new in-game content has been deplorable. Really, they could give us new stuff that was not tied into the storyline in any meaningful way. We won't complain. We will gladly, greedily, go enjoy our new content without worry, fear, or concern for how well it does or doesn't tie into plot.

For realz....like it makes sense from a story perspective that rommil and friends have infiltrated the Fire Storm Citadel and defeated Lord Vanaduke.....15 million times!!!!

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 21:59

#18

Zephyrgon

OOOOOOKAAAAAAAYYYY

I really don't think that this was productive to begin with. If you were here, last year, when the game first came, before the dreaded accessory update, don't you agree that those were the good old times? You guys missed my point here: I'm not saying that people who don't plan to pay should play, but rather they give it a try, and if they like it, they can pay, otherwise, they can leave and find a new game. Honestly. Besides, some people take a while to actually start paying, so it's fine that way.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 22:03

#19

Venomousbiohazard

******!

YOU DISGRACE THE DEADLY VIRULISK NAME! THIS GAME WOULD BE USELESS IF IT WAS P2P ONLY!! *sighs* The beauty of this game is that it is a game that is not necessarily pay to win. Therefore, if you take that element away from the game, the game falls apart. Free players keep the games perfect economy going, and if everyone was p2p then CE would be worth 192 crowns for 100CE. Free to play players are the balance. Take away that balance, and.... Doomsday for Sk. I know you are mad about the lack of good patches, but keep calm, an awesome one is coming.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 22:46

#20

Traevelliath

...

No... Just no.

Games are meant to be played. Thus, what's the point of getting rid of the players?

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 23:17

#21

Derpules

This is silly.

"If you are with me, tell these F2P players to go and leave us alone. Tell them to find and ruin some other game, but not our SK. You will see, if our F2P player base shrinks, our game will become better."

Easy for you to say; you're not the one whose livelihood depends on the success of the game. Ask OOO if it would like all the F2Pers to leave and see what they say. Go on.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 17:11

#22

Byas

Yeah, I remember that time

Yeah, I remember that time and guess what? It was the same thing, except that everyone had clones every f-ing where because there wasn't anything to make an armor look different from another one of the same set (except for the player color but that's almost nothing). The only thing I really miss from that time it's the haven arcade's crowded way, there was always new people there to help and meet, aside from a different path every time... The missions update just killed it. You must be butthurt because some F2P got better gear than you or something of the like but believe me, getting rid of F2P wouldn't balance the economy, it would destroy it (imagine a place where CE is worth nothing and crowns are the supreme coin).

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 23:30

#23

Razor-Dash

@Zephyrgon Please, kindly do

@Zephyrgon Please, kindly do us F2Pers a favor, and keep that abomination of yours you call a mouth shut.
Thank you.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 23:40

#24

Kitty-Softpaws

Zeph has a point but OOO is a

Zeph has a point but OOO is a get-support/funds type of company. If SK went P2P this game would be more dead than it is now in both the arcade & the mission runs. F2P > P2P players on here. Three Rings isn't BioWare or Bungie or Blizzard. I used to be F2P but now SK & Whirled are all the games I ever play so now I'm a full supporter to OOO since Whirled is also another game from OOO. OP you are false. F2P IS the population of this game.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 23:39

#25

Divisor

Wow... just wow...

I don't want to live on this planet anymore.

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 23:52

#26

Sniperjoe

Hmmm...

*waits patiently for a GM to notice this thread*

Sun, 05/06/2012 - 23:57

#27

Kimahsonite

+1 Razordash

Spiral Knights is meant to be a 'F2P' game. :| However, I'm planning to buy CE in the future.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 00:01

#28

Kraanx

^ THAT(what happened in the

^ THAT(what happened in the comment above),zephyrgon, is how things normally work in here.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 00:23

#29

Raisinfist

/applauds Razordash

Well, of all the people who I know/am friends with in SK, every single one is f2p. That tells you how small the p2p minority is.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 00:23

#30

Tersakaff

"Go shove all the F2Ps in

"Go shove all the F2Ps in that assault on machine shop prestige with the neverending devilites, and stick some firepits too cause I want ce to be lower even if apparently that would mean I buy not sell ce thus I should be thrown there too! :D"

Can't tell if trolling or just stupid.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 00:45

#31

Nubskills

Nyan nyan nyan nyan....

Zeph, what about semi F2P/P2P players? You know, those that use money as an item booster or to acquire ingame cosmetics and convenience? Two types of people? Some players transit between those, are you saying that they're two types of people? Lol stereotypes rarely work, there're too many other factors.
Did you say buying CE is pumping crowns into the economy? Um, that's taking crowns out, since other players are buying your CE, while youre pulling crowns out of the economy. It's them who are buying your CE.
Oh right, and I still don't see how F2P players are a problem. With most of the playerbase as F2P, there would be a much higher demand for content such as the Core compared to a mostly-P2P playerbase. Plus, if the majority can't pay, they won't benefit much from it anyway, meaning that, according to your reasoning and some common sense, there would be more promos with less F2P players. Not that I think OOO would change their updates much with regard to this, content updates do require a ton of work.
Notice the lack of rage, rejection and insults in my post. I'm hoping that you'll see how most people are viewing this situation. The SK forum community is one of the best I've seen, I'd prefer to keep it that way. Less rage=moar profit

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 00:57

#32

Niichi

I'm struggling to see how removing all the players that have paid in nothing contributes to more money for OOO to concentrate on new gameplay content. All the servers still have to be running. All the staff still have to be paid. The amount of money coming in from customers will increase by exactly zero (and may even go down - I had been playing SK for several months before the concept of paying in had even crossed my mind).

Where exactly is this extra money supposedly coming from?

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 01:04

#33

Villainus

Wow..

As quite a few people have been saying this is a blatant attack on f2ps. Even worse? It has no real economic basis. If f2ps left the CE price would go down so low that this game would fall prey to hyper inflation. OOO would have to make 10$ worth more CE every month destabilizing the game economy. So little reasoning so much hate.. The game would also lose it's luster for P2ps because no one would play

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 02:43

#34

Ariasky

What a love-hate relationship we have with Three Rings

I want to stay and see Three Rings make the best game they can, even with all the "hate" from impatient people wanting something new(I kinda understand the Beta players, I mean they have been playing the game longer then the most of us playing now),even if I am a "f2p".
Making a game that everyone loves is hard since everyone has different views on things.
Speaking of views, if you take out the "free 2" out of f2p and the "pay 2" out of p2p you'll end up with "players"(if that makes any sense), what we all are, no matter what differences we both have, we are still People that love and enjoy the game(and you can't change that), but it seems people forgot about...

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 02:09

#35

Raisinfist

Oh, by the way...

As Villanus said (all credit to him):
'As quite a few people have been saying this is a blatant attack on f2ps.'
And I ask the OP: Against ToS much?

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 03:24

#36

Eternal-Koniko

Zephyrgon, You should go, and never come back :D

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 04:05

#37

Lanieu

F2P

I'm F2P.

I buy the CE p2p players purchase. I keep them buying. Which keeps OOO happy.

I think I won the argument.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 04:21

#38

Enclavean

Among my RL friends, we use

Among my RL friends, we use "grape" as an alternative to my "behind."

So... YOU CAN KISS MY GRAPE

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 04:25

#39

Villainus

Haha Kraanx that made lol

Another problem in your argument Zephyrgon. There are a lot more F2ps than P2ps. If you think that p2ps generate more crs than the whole f2p player base... This whole post is based on the invalid argument that the game would be great if everyone payed cash to buy mounds of CE. And accessories? P2ps stay because of accessories! Even if no valid content comes for months, you still need that crowning glory to add to your costume. Also CE promos blocking new content? BS. It is not that hard to create a new accessory and attach it to a promo, compared to the difficulties of creating new content.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 04:51

#40

Paweu

This game is about

This game is about socialising, if you effectively cut out 95% of the playerbase it will become a ghost town and according to your definition every player is P2P because everyone playing the game deep inside would want to pay to support it.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 05:29

#41

Ndognine-Forums

To be honest, I don't really

To be honest, I don't really mind f2p players. HOWEVER, what I do hate is when they straight up BRAG they are f2p. The game runs on both parties to create a stable economy, but if there were no p2p players there would be no CE and therefore no game.

Oh, and next time you want to brag your f2p, you know that 5* item you love so much? YOUR WELCOME.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 05:34

#42

Strudul

I will just leave this here.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 05:57

#43

Theirillusion

as you said

as you said zepthyrgon,
"F2P:
These people are the ones who do NOT contribute into the economy at all: they don't buy CE, promos, and all the other things."

if all players were f2p, how can that result in more ce promos??

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 06:31

#44

Pepperonius

This has been said

but i'm going to elaborate on how the market works.

P2P buy the CE, and post it to the market to sell. The f2p buy this CE, at a specific price. The fewer people buying CE with crowns, the less demand there is. Without F2P, there would be very little demand for CE, as P2P buy CE with cash. At first you say "great, CE would be cheap!" . THink about it though.

CE would plummet, and instead of getting 6k cr/100 ce, you are now getting 3, or 2k cr per 100 CE. The Auction house crashes, the cost for items skyrockets, and pretty soon everything goes to hell. The economy is most stable with CE equating between 5k and 6.5k cr per 100 CE. F2P keep the demand for CE up there, and the price relatively stable.

The accessory promos that ruined the game for you are another factor in the stabilization of the market. By introducing an influx of CE from teh p2pers, in exchange (basically) for a cosmetic item, we buy the CE. We sell the CE to stock up on CR, and buy those fancy items on the AH. THe f2p continue to buy our CE, at a slightly lower price while the promo is on. ETC.

Do you see why this works? Why we need the F2P/P2P balance? I read your post, and i know you aren't saying get rid of them completely... you want fewer of them. Problem is, eliminating them before they have a chance to become p2p prevents the growth of the game. We need some of those F2P to become P2P, and they will. THey just need time.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 06:47

#45

Hijadestone

Haven't read all posts yet

but the op this is some idiot who had a bad day so he is having a temper tantrum

Problems with this
1: if there are one million players 100k are p2p the rest f2p if you cut 900k people there will be explaining to do every one will be fired and spiral knights will no longer exist
2: most p2p player are horrible you think oh this guy did och he must be good a teir 2 wolver bites him to death in a solo fight man he sucks
3: f2p players offen think things p2p players buy are dumb and I get to ruin the economy today cause I am going to craft 2 4* items today

And I had to use restraint not to cuss every 2 words

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 06:52

#46

Eltia

F2P are not customers

P2P are. Therefore, the only logical thing for OOO to invest time in is to convert F2P into P2P. Since P2P already invested money into the game, when they walked, OOO didn't lose anything.

Wake up people. Why do you think OOO has been polishing over and over again the rescue camp and the beginner's experience? It makes sense, right?

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 07:11

#47

God-King

I'll just drop this link

I'll just drop this link here.

http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/microtransactions

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 07:23

#48

Juances

Too many walls of text, I'll be short:

Top players dont need energy, they need crowns to roill super UVs and get fancy accesories.
What's the fastest way to get crowns? buying energy and selling it to F2Ps.
We need each other. Symbiosis.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 07:33

#49

Fehzor

Oh, you want me to leave the

Oh, you want me to leave the game because I don't pay for the devs (even if it is only because I think they could do better with SK)? Well ok, I'd better go. See you guys later!

I think you should even have an ethnic cleansing of F2Pers. Film it and put it on youtube so I can watch.

Mon, 05/07/2012 - 07:36

#50

Trying

F2P 2012!!!

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F2P players must go !!! The explanation of the problems of this game !!!