Spiral Knights - my 2 cents on this Black Kat event

my 2 cents on this Black Kat event

18 replies [Last post]

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 04:19

Rhagnarock

I don't get why you put the new items behind such a grind wall.

I mean... having a BKC is being lucky (which I was in the first event), most people got their BKC by the 2nd event... and now the third event requires for a single knight to attend 6 dark ritual in order to get a SINGLE NEW items from the event.

The new Torto gun were the same price as the shields. It was a legitimate grind that relied on RNG only for the ancient shell spawns. Which varied from 2 to 6.

The chance to get a BK is rather great, but finding a book of dark ritual is impossible for some. My guildmaster ragebuy the BKC after hitting 1,000 ancient page and THAT much frustration. A SINGLE BOOK. He hasn't drop one yet, with this 3rd event he "may" drop one.

But that's just ONE book. You have to attend 6 dark ritual to get a single 5* items. How is that legitimate grind? I don't feel the reward for payout is that great and like many mentionned, the BKC mail is the same price as the other underpower one, nobody will go for the other armor other than for skin and costume purpose (like I did for all the masks)

I grinded D2 for 5k hours, SK for about 2.6k hours (according to Steam, over 100 days according to SK). But I have no intention of actively looking for a book. It is impossible to attend 6 dark ritual in just 12 days. I attended at least 8 dark ritual in all the time I've played on SK and that's because I got nothing but pages 7 times out of the 8th... because one was my book.

The wicked whiskers are bound to you, not tradable, not sellable, not craftable, people rage to get one book, now you have to find 6 or pay huge amount of cr to "take a spot" on a dark ritual. Which is more about marketing and merchanting than anything else

just my 2 cents on how bad black kat grind has become. Impossible, farming 5k tokens in apocrean for a grasping aura was a piece of cake compare to the RNG fest you gave us OOO

Edit: So mathematically speaking, there will be 6 times more Black Kat Cowl in circulation on Haven in order to get a single Black Kat Raiment in circulation

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 04:51

Paintool

Also good luck findind anyone

Also good luck findind anyone with a generic kat raiment, since the BKR is just as easy if not more valuable to craft.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 05:09

Bopp

1.5; otherwise, all been said already

Everything here has already been said in the main thread of discussion about the update.

Your calculation that there will be 6 times as many BKC as BKR is incorrect, or at least too simplistic. Each Margrel fight effectively yields one BKC and 4/6 of a BKR. So, in the long run, there should be 1.5 times as many BKCs as BKRs.

Also, as others have pointed out, there is not much advantage to the 5-star version over the 3-star version. In other words, you can get extremely powerful armor for just one Wicked Whisker.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 05:40

Rhagnarock

my 2 cents

@ Bopp the point of introducing new gear is for people to have it

Wicked Whiskers are bound to you when you get them, yes doing a fight yield 4 mats, but a single knight will have one, you have to ask for someone to get their whisker, craft the 3* suit and then buy it off them, it's highly unlikely.

I always said that was for a single knights getting the 5* items. 3* items get you instakill in 2 shot in FSC, there's no point having a 3* armor/helm due to the defense discrepency.

In order to get a 5* you need 6 dark ritual on your own, or having rich people that don't mind giving you/selling you a 1m+ item (which is the 3* BKC mail)

Edit: I also don't write in the flooded "update" discussion because of how chaotic it gets. #HYPE #BKISALLTHATEXISTINSK #INEVERUSEBKCCAUSECHAOSHASCTRSONOUVFORME #RIPSK #NOBODYPLAYLD #NEEDMOARRADIANT

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 07:33

Bopp

response

@ Bopp the point of introducing new gear is for people to have it

Yes. That's why there's a huge thread of people complaining just like you. I'm not saying that you shouldn't complain. I'm just saying that you're about the 200th person to make this complaint.

Yes, Wicked Whiskers are bound. But if you and three of your friends do 6 Dark Rituals, then you will collectively end up with 6 BKCs and 4 BKRs. This is the sense in which BKCs are 1.5 times as common as BKRs. Of course, it is hard for 4 knights to get 6 Books in the first place. That's why I said "in the long run".

I always said that was for a single knights getting the 5* items. 3* items get you instakill in 2 shot in FSC, there's no point having a 3* armor/helm due to the defense discrepency.

No. Just look at all of the knights who use Swiftstrike Buckler. All of this armor is "glass cannon". Only end-game players who are good at dodging should be wearing it. Also, detailed study of damage and status defense suggests that damage protection on armor has only a small effect. Combine these ideas, and you see that the 3-star version has nearly the same practical value as the 5-star version.

I'm not defending the decision by Three Rings to make BKR so hard to obtain. I'm just pointing out some weaknesses in your argument, so that you can improve your argument. By the way, that's the advantage of reading the mega-thread. All of this has already been figured out there.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 07:50

Abelisk

dude chill and smoke some

60 black kats = 180 pages
You can make a black seraphynx with that.
Black seraphynx = 400-500k cr

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 08:03

Flowchart

They want the stuff to take several events to obtain so that they can reuse events and not have to make anything new for them.

Kind of like when they first introduced Apocrea and said something like it would take several events to get the weapons.. then lots of people got them on the first day lol

Too bad this was the only way they could think of to do it.

@Itsmeandersonlol
You want profit per page, sell BK hoods, I sold a few on AH with my extra pages and hardly anyone else had them up.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 08:57

Skepticraven

↓

@Bopp

"Also, detailed study of damage and status defense suggests that damage protection on armor has only a small effect. Combine these ideas, and you see that the 3-star version has nearly the same practical value as the 5-star version."

Just to clarify... For depths 1-18 (T1 and T2), the defense is almost identical.
However with the given patterns, 3* armor will not be close to 5* armor in T3 areas. Quicksilver (3*) reduces almost half the normal damage compared to Mercurial mail (5*, same crafting line). [32 compared to 58 damage reduced]. Rock jelly (equivalent of charged quicksilver, the 4* of the line), on the other hand reduces the same as the 5* armor on depth 23. Given the patterns, there would be a small difference between the two as you go further into stratum 6.

I would conclude that the 5* version of the black kat armor is not worth obtaining at all. (The other 3 specialized lines are worth upgrading from 4* to 5* for the additional bonuses.) The 4* has significantly more armor than the 3* version for T3 areas only.
I agree on all the other points Bopp has listed, especially where armor or health does not particularly make a difference for the designed usage of this armor (glass cannon).

All data from this post was taken from this study of mine. I also made a suggestion to correct this 4*-5* upgrading imbalance here.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 09:24

Bopp

thanks

Thanks for trying to keep me honest. But let's clarify one more thing.

3* armor will not be close to 5* armor in T3 areas. Quicksilver (3*) reduces almost half the normal damage compared to Mercurial mail (5*, same crafting line). [32 compared to 58 damage reduced].

So wearing the 5-star armor instead of the 3-star armor will leave you with 26 more points of health after a normal attack? At 40 points per bar, that's 2/3 of a bar, right? I consider this to be a small effect.

Edit: The 5-star armor also has 2 more health than the 3-star version. So the bar difference is 2 + 2/3 * numberOfAttacks, not just 2/3 * numberOfAttacks.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 09:46

Parasthesia

Also as far as PVP is

Also as far as PVP is concerned... People up in arms are forgetting about the 3* black Kat hood that provides damage and Msi bonuses of a previously 20k energy highly sought after item... For only 70 tokens, easily achievable before the events end time by doing the daily prestige and several lucky Kat encounters. I'm surprised bkc's won't have majorly dropped in price by the end of this event.

Maybe guns will actually be decent in t2 now.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 09:47

#10

Holy-Nightmare

Indeed the only place the

Indeed the only place the 3star kat even items are of real use are in T2 LD (which is hardly ever played nowadays)

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 10:52

#11

Parasthesia

The 3* Kat items BESIDES the

The 3* Kat items BESIDES the black Kat versions, you mean.

I've touted the 3* black Kat hood as the thrifty man's BKC for t3 as well, or wear it with ancient plate. Heart trinkets make the 2 pips only minimally noticeable, even though they do matter.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 10:53

#12

Parasthesia

The 3* Kat items BESIDES the Black Kat versions you mean

Double post

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 11:30

#13

Turn-Me-On

Theoretically, how much would

Theoretically, how much would the 5* raiment be worth if one were to unbind and sell it?

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 15:26

#14

Abelisk

golden banana

Grinding this grinding that... stop being fat and lazy and go kick some black kats! ;p

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 16:24

#15

Golden-Crusaderr

Why make items only a handful

Why make items only a handful will ever own what about the rest of the population

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 22:50

#16

Avihr

Copper Orange

@Mr. Anderson:
if you are seriously willing to dispose of hours and hours of your life playing a videogame trying to obtain a book that has about 0.something chance of dropping from a special monster that has about a 3% chance of replacing a normal kat over a series of periods of two weeks between 5 months each and happen to find said book SIX GOD BLESSED TIMES, then i would say that you are the one that is fat and lazy ;)

people want this armors, be it for asthetics or for its stats, but actually trying to obtain them is a matter of asking yourself these questions:

1) Am i insane?

2)Am i Rich?

if you didn't answer any of the above with a yes then this event is not for you.

Fri, 09/19/2014 - 20:32

#17

Abelisk

hey macarana

Well in just 2 days with an hour or two each day, I have found 14 black kats so just 86 to go to find a book. (according to statistics)

Sun, 09/21/2014 - 01:20

#18

Bitsbee

“if you are seriously willing to dispose of hours and hours of your life playing a videogame trying to obtain a book that has about 0.something chance of dropping from a special monster that has about a 3% chance of replacing a normal kat over a series of periods of two weeks between 5 months each and happen to find said book SIX GOD BLESSED TIMES, then i would say that you are the one that is fat and lazy”

That's not lazy, that's mindless dedication. Lazy would be buying it off someone.

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my 2 cents on this Black Kat event