Draycos brought this up previously and I continue to disagree with it. refer to #4

I don't think the specialness gained from these events makes the amount of content they have anywhere near worth hiding away with the state SK is in. Like not even close.

I think I will just readdress some of the things back in the debate and why I think making these events permanent will not save the game:

-Making these events permanent piss off the hardcore players, remember that black kat set you slaved years to get? Well jokes on you, because now every knight can obtain it. This only to serve to alienate those who have invested the patience and effort to get those set in the first place by devaluing the gears (ie. making them common), if everyone can get BKC on the fly, there would be no point in getting other gears. Making SK even more monotonous than before with everyone in LD running BK set.

-More content =/= Good content, I am sure Zeddy is planning to drown me in data but I have a life raft prepared just for this occasion, if you weren't here for the gunner update, I will fill you in on the impression of the community when it came out: 'meh'. There were simply too many gunner armors, although new, they were nothing to write home about and only to serve to show how little thought was actually invested into the set's stats, in the past we used to have to carefully gear up for the level in question, nowadays, just pick that gunner armor with the respective resistance and you are all set. And before you know it, the player base dropped again.

Now if we make the events fully permanent (as in, you can play tortodrone right after an apocrea run just by selecting the mission cards), the contents will get burned out very quickly. This has already had an effect on the SK player base when the forge update hit the shelf, people blitzing through the story mission in one day, stuck at the orb paywall and gave up after not looting enough of them in the clockwork. Making apocrea/tortodrone/BK permanent will only to serve to kill this game faster.

-SK may not survive another major overhaul What do all we have in common? As human beings? We are ALL AFRAID OF CHANGE. That is right, deny it all you want, call yourself progressive, but the fear of change is something far beyond our control, it is written into our DNA since the dawn of mankind. And why am I telling you all of this? Because I want to show you that some people just like the game the way it is. <--- just watch this video if you are still not understanding what I mean.

SK have changed many times, three major overhauls (mission -> binding -> forge) in the past five years, and regardless of whether they were good or bad for SK, one part of the player base is going to leave. One of my IRL friends refused to return after the forge update, one could only wonder how many other old players left after these overhauls of the game they once enjoyed. Change is not always for the better, and I can assure you that some people will leave if what you are suggesting ever come to pass, and may just deliver the killing blow for SK.

Pretend I said piercing Acheron instead of piercing Sentenza and adress the actual points brought up in that topic.

Are you addressing about the old thread you brought up? Because I thought you were going to show me something that numerically proves that new content is always superior to the status quo.

@Mrsnippy

I find your disposition to be silly, frankly.

You know what it certainly won't survive? Staying the way it is.

I find your respond to be silly, frankly, no one ever said this game should stay the way it is, but overall some people will not like the change and leave the game as the result. GH needs to balance out the loss/gain if they ever want to make a massive change to SK, making sure that what they updated is better than what it was before, sure people will always leave because of changes, but maybe in return more people will return as the result of the change.

Now the only question remained is: will making events permanent bring more people back than it is going to put off? I reckon, no, because the forge update was a testament to my point that 'more content =/= good content', the faster you let the player burn through the content, the more likely the player base will loose its passion for these events. People wanted these events to be permanent because they were semi-permanent, there are two tragedies in life, one is not getting what you want, the other is getting it.

TL;DR poorly thought out overhaul only serves more to harm SK than making it better

@Mrsnippy
I agree we need more content, but event's should stay rare. I may make a thread with suggestions for new content, but I'm not sure if Grey Haven have the recourses for larger projects yet... ^^

Edit: Why not? I'll just go ahead... :P

@Midnight-Dj
Woaw... He must have done something terrible... Like stealing someones candy... O.O

Or we could, I dunno, not have the events permanent, just longer.

Decreasing it by 10% will fix the problem.
Making it permanent means you are removing the event, and over time, the game itself.

@Mrsnippy

Who said anything about the events having to be annual?

There are 3 events that aren't attached to a specific holiday. What we can do is have each event once a month, for 2-3 weeks rather than 1-2 weeks, like so:

Jan - Event 1
Feb - Event 2
Mar - Event 3
Apr - Caketastrophe
May - Event 1
Jun - Event 2
Jul - Event 3
Aug - Event 1
Sep - Event 2
Oct - Dark Harvest
Nov - Event 3
Dec - Winterfest

With this, we wouldn't have to wait an entire year for the event to come back. And since GH can run the monthly gemstone promos, it'll give people a bigger, if ever so slightly, reason to buy the prize boxes.

Of course, I'm trying to find something of a compromise between permanent events or not. It's just a suggestion.

entire BLESSING. Do not shove the game into Mordor.
EDIT: We also suggest to Grey Havens now. \---| |^|

Events =/= The bosses we have in the game without having to buy anything.
If anything, Events = Operation Crimson Hammer.
And, besides, I simply just cannot handle a monster that can shove me into Mordor just by looking at me.
And, while I agree we need Tortodrones to use in customizable Guild Missions, having ALL of those for the ENTIRE PERMANENT GAME would Apocrea this game into Mordor.
I hear the Graveyard is very nice this time of year. Especially for Apocreans.
EDIT: The Spiral Knights Grey Havens team IS Three Rings.

Alright, wow. Okay. I'm surprised this thread isn't just "yeah more content more often is good". People are arguing that legit, end-game, difficult content being on a limited timer is a good thing for end-game players? Okay sure, yeah, totally makes sense.

Having events be more accessible year round but having "concentrated times" would be amazing. It makes arcade so much more valuable, and also makes the game a bit more exciting. All the while you have concentrated times to farm these items but can still collect them year round.

Rare items don't have to be time-locked. True love lockets aren't time locked and you know what? They're still valued pretty high. They are of equal use as a penta heart pendant but are still desirable and useful. Darkfang shield as well - it's only 4* but my god are people willing to pay an arm and a leg for such a thing.

Additionally, something Zeddy was trying to get at was that event-related gear isn't anything special. Poison shadow brandish is useful because it's a poison shadow brandish, not because it's an apocrean reward. Black kat cowl is useful because damage high and MSI low, not because it's obtained from 1% drop from a 1% enemy replacement. Voltaic Temptest is useful because it's a shock mist bomb, not because it's a roarmulus twins reward.
Do you see people using the normal resist tortoshield? No, because its stats aren't that great. It's an event item but not very useful.

Personally, I would have events on a 1 week rotation. What that means is once a month we'll have an event. Time-based events can overlap with weekly events. Because of this, event payoffs can be decreased, however the fact they exist monthly makes them easier to wait for. It make take a month or two to get your black kat cowl, but it's better than waiting half a year to farm for 3 days straight to only have a chance at it, then have to wait another 6 months and hope the event comes around again.

Additionally if we do this, we can balance the events out more fairly. Black kat event needs an overhaul anyways, so having constant feedback instead of condensed suggestions when the event is happening would prove beneficial.

Just a thing people say.

why would I bother to grind for black kats if they would just come back the next week?

Because the reason people are grinding black kats is for the useful gear it provides. Alternatively for costume purposes. If you think we grind black kats for the bragging rights of saying how much time we wasting on RNG then I'll have to break your forehead with a physics textbook.

If you're trying to tell me that people are not grinding black kat event for a chance to get a book of dark rituals so they can either A) fight margrel B) get a BKC or C) get a BKR, then I don't know what to tell you.

Ask players who are veterans, they will tell you they run it for profit/gear. Ask a new player, and they're running it for gear. The events are centered around acquiring unique gear, so why are we withholding entire playstyles from a large portion of the playerbase?

Collectors are few and far between. Once they get an item they're done, onto the next. When they've collected everything, they stop playing - there's no reason to continue.

It sounds like you're trying to appeal to a small number of people who will be upset. The change to the steam achievements happened lately, and you know how many people were upset? None. Only people who were upset were upset about the residue it left behind on steam, not the actual removal of the achievements from steam. I assure you, if events came back on a schedule and more frequently, you'd see more people participating in events instead of logging off for several months because they're waiting for an event to continue playing.

First off, I'm in Echo of Silence, and I assure you the "collectors" you speak of that may or may not live within those walls are on the same page about event gears being not a great way to hold content out of our reach. In the 107 members we have currently, we might have maybe one or two collectors? Only person I can think of that is a collector isn't in EoS anymore.

So you've converted from a collector to a casual gamer. Oh what do you know, you already have all the gear ever, but what's this? New players want an obsidian edge because they wish to poison gremlins in gremlin arenas with a bunch of menders around? Heresy!

You say people "may do it for no reason". If you can give me examples of said people who do that, I might be more keen to believe you. Every single person I've talked to about events on the forums, in game, etc runs events for three reasons: gear, profit, or challenge. I had a friend who ran grinchlin for profit, as they were selling winterfest reskins and rings they found. I have quite a few guildies who run tortodrones because it's fun to fight them. Countless people have been running black kat events in hopes of finding their first book of dark rituals for a black kat cowl.

Having gear locked behind time walls doesn't make the gear any more special, just harder to acquire. Heck, not even harder to acquire, just requires much more waiting to get said item.

I guess you and zeddy will never understand where I am getting at, most people are afraid of change
And I guess you will never understand that the purpose of MMO games if for them to change as time goes on. If you can name me a single MMO that hasn't had a change since launch and maintained a healthy playerbase for several years I will be impressed. Yes, people are afraid of change, but you know what change is here for? Making the game better.

Sure, some changes are not always good, but for every bad change we've had in Spiral Knights there have been handfuls of good ones. The logic you're trying to pull for changing how events work would literally run every MMO ever into the ground.

See, while I'm a person who, over the ages, has mentioned I'm fine with things the way they are, that doesn't mean I look at every change negatively. Know what was a cool change? Dash and bash. What else? Battle sprites. The people who leave over something as small as "change" are often already put up with other things, but haven't pinpointed anything to make them leave, and then a change happens and they point at it and use it to run away making a huge fuss feeling justified in their actions.