Why Enjoy some thing that you need to pay your way in.... that's not fun, or find some rare shadow key or buy it at the AH for loads of money just to see the new content... you call that fun... nop that's not fun at all.
i waste over 100 buck every month in SK for energy and that's fun because with out energy your out of luck. but waste real money on a key that will brake or one time use, i think its a waste of time... if the key was for ever or bound to you to be use for ever like a a equipment, then it will be fun to get or buy.
but im not going to waste money on a key that will be broken or use 1 time... nop not me.
The "Official" Anti-Shadow Key petition
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 13:50
#52
Why Enjoy
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 13:56
#53
I'm trolling to make a point, like I always do in General Discus
sion. Entitled brats are in very high number here (and in all games) and rationality is definitely lacking. It's just the same [crap] rehashed. New, essential content is one thing, but this is superfluous.
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 14:00
#54
It's just the same [crap]
It's just the same [crap] rehashed. New, essential content is one thing, but this is superfluous.
So assuming this was actual genuinely new content, would your stance on the matter be different?
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 14:03
#55
It probably would be
but I still wouldn't throw a hissy fit like a 4 year old that sees a toy he wants but cannot get at Toys R Us.
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 14:07
#56
Don't be silly, four year
Don't be silly, four year olds don't waste their time writing out pointlesslt obnoxious rants on the internet!
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 14:11
#57
Fist time i've been against
Fist time i've been against new content OOO. Not gonna lie guys. I have been sticking up for you guys at the timese wherein the CE prices for crafting increased. I sticked with you guys with alot of changes that I thought made alot of sense.
I had alot of respect for your design philosophies behind every decision, but with this little update, all that respect has gone down the drain.
I went into spiral after 2 days looking forward to new content but instead you guys have left a sour taste in my mouth. I don't think I may log into the game for a while after this untill it gets fixed. I got alot of other games to play anyway. Nonetheless spiral was always a blast to run through and it felt good being part of it.
I would brag about OOO at other forums and point in your direction as devs that know what they're doing. Not anymore OOO. The latest update is "disgusting"
signed the petition :)
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 15:48
#58
agree with Hanktron
I largely agree with Hanktron. The developers of the game are collecting lots of data on who plays each aspect of Spiral Knights, how much money they spend, and how. If nobody plays Shadow Lairs, then the developers will realize that and fix it. Conversely, if they do not alter how the Shadow Lairs work in the coming weeks, then you can conclude that there really are people playing the darn thing. You might not know them, perhaps because they are too busy playing Spiral Knights to post on these forums.
Just remember: Three Rings knows more, thinks more, and cares more about Spiral Knights than you do.
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 16:16
#59
Signed. for OP its cool to
Signed. for OP its cool to have revamped old bosses... i dont see why that is bad... cool updates, But the cost is ridiculous and probably not the best idea so far the whole shadow key thing... get a rare lockbox, get a key to open that lockbox, hope to get another key lol... or yeah pay whatever awful amount just do attempt a boss that you will probably wipe on / not get a chance to even learn.
There is a point that you can stop trying to make $$$ and focus on the players of the game, this key thing might make a lot of end-game players leave....
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 16:36
#60
Belated reply is Belated
Certainly, but the point is to prove statiscally how many people are disatisfied with the content, and consequently getting an idea of just how much of the community OOO is flat out ignoring if they don't change anything.
Ah, misunderstood it then. I assumed it was another one of those petitions that some excited kid tried to force upon the developers, not an actual collection of outraged users. Good on you, then.
To be honest, I love the content itself, even though it is just a stamp, it gives you familiar battling techniques with new preperations. I do believe a way to gain keys through another means should be available. Even if it's thousands of crowns.
The condition being people don't [tart] about the Crown price, too.
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 16:48
#61
lol statistics
I agree that Spiral Knights design decisions should be guided by a statistical sense of what the players want.
There is no way that this petition will give valid statistical information about the level of dissatisfaction among players. The main issue is that the survey design is obviously grossly biased. (Dissatisfied players will find and respond to this petition/survey disproportionately.)
There's only one place I can imagine that actually has statistical information on how players view Shadow Lairs: Three Rings' server logs. I'm sure that they monitor many aspects of gameplay. They know how many Lockboxes have been opened, and how many Shadow Keys have been generated, and how many parties have attempted the Shadow Lairs. If no players actually play the darn thing, Three Rings will know, and, because they don't want to drive their business into the ground, they'll fix things.
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 16:53
#62
Signed.
Look, I don't like how we have to pay just to see these new things, I don't care what the Crown price is, some people just don't have credit cards or bank cards.
Signed.
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 16:59
#63
Ya I agree with Bopp, and I
Ya I agree with Bopp, and I think this is already starting to happen because a few days ago there was a good amount of ppl selling Shadow keys in the AH. But over the past few days that number has been going down. So either more ppl have been using them instead of selling them, hoarding them, or ppl just aren't opening lockboxes much anymore.
Thu, 10/20/2011 - 18:31
#64
@Djbiomas I think an initial
@Djbiomas I think an initial load of shadow keys were stuffed in the AH by OOO themselves. I can't imagine that players found 10 of them from boxes right off the bat and set them all up in the AH with no buyout price. (not that I'm implying there's anything wrong with that)
As for monitoring the stats on gameplay, maybe it's just the statistician in me, but it'd certainly be interesting to take a peek behind the curtain to see just how much data they're collecting. Companies like Valve gather epic amounts of data from their games, everything from putting together heat maps for levels to identify choke points and balance issues, to running stats on gear and class combination effectiveness and so on. I'm not sure that OOO has the resources to pull off the really fancy data collection, but it'd still be fun to know how in depth they go.
I'm sure they're collecting data on how many boxes are being popped, how many keys are being discovered, and how many of them are being sold, hoarded, or used, but it'll probably take a few days, or even a week or two, to get a good enough statistical picture to judge the player reaction.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 02:38
#65
Just remember: Three Rings
Just remember: Three Rings knows more, thinks more, and cares more about Spiral Knights than you do.
They also know more, think about more and care moe about their financial situation than I do. They're aren't going to completely drive the game into the dirt but to assume they aren't willing to make sacrafices on the community's part if it will make them more money in the long run strikes me as a rather naive and optimistic view. More the point I'd argue that a great deal of the more dedicated players cleary have a far better understanding of the balance issues in the game that OOO hasn't addressed, although that's another discussion entirely.
Three Rings' server logs.
However the community doesn't have access to OOO's statistics.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 03:03
#66
Its a good idea...
Its a good idea to keep all dissatisfaction with shadow keys in one place.
As for petition - Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2. 200k players signed a petition to bring back dedicated servers (FPS game that is P2P only is suicide... for players without a damn good internets). Reaction? They said "wow" but nothing really changed (to be precise: no changes were made in the game, it still went on sale as P2P only). Devs said they considered previous experiences in the new MW3 game, will now allow both P2P and dedicated servers, but that game is yet to be released.
My opinion of petitions: companies you petition don't give a damn, since you can't gather enough votes, statistically. You can't BLOCK sales completely, so why should they do anything? If you could tell every player to stop buying CE for $ (and they listened), it would make a world of difference in under a month. Otherwise, you simply won't be heard.
Not signed. I prefer this kind of limitation of access to new T3 content. Only rich people can enter. They're either rich because they pay $$$ and support my favorite (up to date) game (as I do), or they're rich because they're good at making money in this game, and then they earned their key. On top of it this way of access to new content guarantees people who want in, and thus will have to spend $$$ for the game infinitely. Good more. Except it goes against "free to play" principle.
@Nicoya-Kitty
Out of tens of thousands of boxes opened that day some 10 keys COULD have been found. Statistically possible. Also possible they were thrown by OOO to heat up the game, I honestly do not care. I only care for them to drop in price to 2k ce at most so I could afford that ride together with my party.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 03:41
#67
@round
...the funniest thing about mw2 was that many of the thousands that signed that petition to boycott the game were found online playing mw2 on the day of release...
Just like many players in SK that protested in haven, then were seen sporting new armour on the day of release...
Petitions achieve nothing, the only way OOO will change anything is if people:
1. Stop buying ce with $$$
2. Stop buying keys
3. Stop running the shadow lairs
But none of that will happen as you are dealing with a community of addicts with no willpower that have been clamouring for new content for months...
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 04:14
#68
Antoher system ?
I do agree with all that have been said agains shadow keys.
The fact that there is a limit about who can access those HM bosses is okay to me. But I think you should gain access by clearing normal bosses, kinda like a WoW HM system ; you could purchase a boss specific key for, let's say, 500 tokens ? Something like that. Of course, it would be permanent, and the gear you'd be able to craft at the end of the run would be different, depending on the boss you picked.
It would make sense to me. But gambling who will be able to do the bosses... I'd rather play bingo.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 04:24
#69
Common sense.
Just stop buying energy thus supporting 3 Rings. Or simply stop playing the game, there are millions of games out there to devote time and your wallets toward. Ultimately the company will get the hint. You also all seem to forgot players from other countries and languages play who may not even use these forums. Though i've been boycotting Spiral Knights along with my friends and family for many patches now petitions are useless in the forum.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 04:36
#70
Bingo! Never played it
Bingo!
Never played it :P
Either way, I am utterly disappointed at new armors, though I'm happy there is some "hard" content that only good players have access to. Kind of hope to see some of the better players in those levels. And find myself there, of course :) hopefully not lying dead in a corner...
@Bindi-Badgi
No surprises there: petition made no effect on developers before release so people went and bought the game either way to see how it works. I myself supported the idea of dedicated servers, yet purchased the game to see how things are. And it was BAD. Its still bad but for a different reason (bad lags got replaced by uncontrolled cheating). Hopefully SK won't go this way (with bad gameplay).
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 04:44
#71
New content that i'm never
New content that i'm never going to be able to anticipate in still sucks. This shadow lair thing really gotta change quick because the more people gamble on it the more people will get upset WHEN IT DOES CHANGE.
Think about it OOO.
I decided to stop playing but not gonna lie that I like the halloweeen content. Also the new jelly king was a great variation. I think I can understand the reason behind the change. As you guys progress you learn more and probably decided to refine the jelly king, which was pretty messy boss fight when you think about it. It's great now.
Nonetheless the game is still fun and the halloween content is great
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 04:53
#72
I don't have spare money to
I don't have spare money to spend on video games, that's why I'm playing a free to play game. This is the worst handling of in-game content I have ever seen. 4 new bosses that I cant play, 3 new masks that I cant afford, 5 new armor pieces that I wont be able to craft. The first real update to this game in months is just designed to rip people off. If you want to get one of the masks that does not wear off, you need to do 25 runs or buy 750,000 CR with real money. FREE TO PLAY MEANS FREE.
Even if they release the content again later for free it's ridiculous. I really love this game but now I am missing out or frankly being screwed over royally.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 05:01
#73
I'm not saying the new
I'm not saying the new content is bad, it's awesome. Great additions to the game. The new JK is great, now it's do-able by T2 players.
However, I don't like the way you access HM dungenos. I've been playing WoW, so I know what "hours of endless farm" means. But the fact that you have to gamble to get your key is just... Not fun. Especially when you have to do it with real money. There should be a token system, or a very tin (0,1%) chance that a boss will drop the key for its HM version, and the key would be unusable.
Oh, and a last thing : the stuff you get should be 6* star. At least, make it worth playing HM bosses...
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 05:24
#74
signed
signed
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 06:01
#75
you must wait...either be happy or be angry while waiting
Echoez, I understand that Three Rings is out to make money. And you have the right to complain about their design decisions. And there are certainly some players who are outraged over Shadow Lairs.
The question is: How many players can/will afford to play Shadow Lairs, really? I don't know. Neither do you. The only people who know are Three Rings. In a happy coincidence, the only people who can do anything about it are Three Rings!
People are voting with their time and money, and we'll see how this shakes out. While we wait, I'm calmly and happily playing the rest of Spiral Knights.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 06:14
#76
Even something like making
Even something like making the keys not break after a single use and instead lasting for say four uses so a single key lets you experience all the new content would be sufficent, even if the ideal change would be removing the gambling aspect from getting access to the new content.
@Bopp: You seem to be under the false impression that someone can't be happily and calmy playing other, better games while simultaneously voicing their crticism to an update in SK. I haven't touched SK since running through UGWW once to see whether the content was worth the trouble, instead I'm greatly enjoying Dungeon Defenders atm. That doesn't mean I can't spend a few minutes vocalizing the reasons I think this update is a bad thing, nor do I have to be 'angry' while doing so. The people vocalizing their distate for this update do so because they enjoy Spiral Knights and would like to continue enjoying it as opposed to turning away because they feel the game is taking a direction they disagree with, it isn't out a sense of entitlment or fury as so many of you arguing against these points of view continually try to imply.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 06:40
#77
great
Echoez, you seem like a reasonable chap. I am glad to hear that you're putting your time/money where your mouth is. That has a real effect on Three Rings.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 10:49
#78
Solutions
Just to say That I like this game I'm playing it for bit of time now, I never complained, but I find the implementation way of this new event kind of too much.
OOO, just take out the gambling of the process of getting the key, and I think we will all agree, the problem is solved.
Because that's the point, we don't ask for helping us access to get the new stuffs, I'm pretty sure many will, like me, even if they fail in the new hardcore modes, buy again the keys and try again. It is a more viable economical system. Just, make npc's selling the item, at say 1000 ce each, plus rise the cost of elevators (30 ce) in the shadow lairs, and I think it's ok.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 11:06
#79
Yeah, that CoD boycott didn't
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 15:41
#80
Complacent indeed
Echoez said:
So instead of wanting the game we enjoy to get better we should instead be complacent with awful updates we disagree with? More to the point this logic may work for some games (Map packs in FPS for example) but an MMO lives and dies by its content, the whole 'ignore it if you don't like it' nonsense plain and simply doesn't apply here.
This is pretty much the thread right here. I have been playing since preview and have almost 700 hours logged into SK, over half of which was spent fighting in the Clockworks. I waited patiently for months for new Tier 3 PvE content, and instead I got "Hat Knights 2" (read: Team Fortress 2) and Shadow Keys. Aside from being severely disappointed, I have since quit SK, traded away all 15,000 of my remaining CE, and moved on to other games. I will return if new content arrives.
It baffles me as well why people are willing to accept the status quo and turn a blind eye to a poorly made decision (Shadow Keys) and flaky content (hats) when new PvE content hasn't been released in months.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 15:47
#81
@Snorlax & Echoez - Agreed
@Snorlax & Echoez - Agreed 110%... It is the premise behind the content.
That and who is to say this is the last update that gives content only accessible by key?
Perhaps this is the new norm.
Fri, 10/21/2011 - 20:13
#82
I think part of the issue is
I think part of the issue is that there is a lack of communication between TRD and the community. After the infamous May 15th update, there was a significant exodus of veteran and beta players, as well as a boycott of buying CE led by Magnus. Ironically, Magnus still plays, but I speculate that he is no longer friendly with the dev team, despite being a long-time beta player. If he reads this then I'll let him speak for himself.
As a result, Spiral Knights players probably consist mostly of people who don't give a crap about the direction of the game. On the other side of things, TRD doesn't have the biggest dev team (consisting of less than a dozen people the last time I checked) nor are very experienced with a game like Spiral Knights; in fact, it's their first MMO. However, I think that they've done a fantastic job so far.
I still have some confidence that Spiral Knights will still be the game that I've always envisioned it to be: a game of adventure where your survival depends almost entirely on how well you can fight, set on a mysterious planet that was crash landed on. It has so much potential. I think that this will happen once they get their whole F2P model up and running and are generating significant enough revenue to hire a few developers that will focus on the aspects that I've mentioned. I would like to come back to this game in a year and see that things have changed for the better.
because it adds content
All updates add content. Why is restricting that content to the people swimming in large pools of money a good thing?
I'm not some over-privileged, entitled brat that demands the world on a silver platter.
Funny how you continually try and present yourself as an intellectual and frequently tell people to be rational yet retort to pety insults when you have nothing better to say. Honeslty I can't tell if you're simply dense or just trolling, although I'm inclined to think the latter at this point.