There have been constant threads in the suggestions forums about making weapons like Wild Hunting Blade or Irontech Destroyer etc. better. Not only that, but armor sets that are lacking. The following has been the action taken to balance this game:
1. Brandish lines, already viable and great weapons, are buffed.
2. 0 and 1 star items are buffed.
Are our priorities a little off? I haven't seen much people angry about this which really surprises me.
No kidding.
Was this patch a form of stalling? Or what? It just doesn't make sense.
Like.... for a comparison.... You have a rock and a cake to give your kid to eat, you give the poor thing the rock?
Maybe the cake is waiting for us?
I mean, adding the Explosions to the Edge Swords is pretty Cool, but how does a Shovel, Pick-Axe & Plain Blade make an Explosion?
http://a2.twimg.com/profile_images/1591301401/Jackie-Chan-Meme.jpg
Make ItD & BAB betta, OOO!
I think the problem now is that the 0 and 1 star weapons just took the one thing that made the brandish line special.
I really am a tad confused about this patch. I don't particularly understand why those weapons needed a sort of "balancing."
Everyone just skips to 2-star weapons nowadays.
"I think the problem now is that the 0 and 1 star weapons just took the one thing that made the brandish line special."
Yes. Just, yes. My Blazebrand feels like a Hipster now.
"Hey, Proto Sword. I made Explosions before they were Cool."
The pickaxe is breaking rocks wherever it lands for it's explosion. The shovel is throwing a dirt explosion.
And the plain sword?
...
CHAKRA!
"I really am a tad confused about this patch. I don't particularly understand why those weapons needed a sort of "balancing."
Everyone just skips to 2-star weapons nowadays."
Right? I mean, I don't even see anyone Charging them in T1...
That's probably because it's Infested with Striker who just Spam their Attacks...
We need answers, this is fully outrageous, not a little.
Maybe,
1. Changes to big angry bomb
2. changes to irontech
3. changes to wild hunting blade
4. changes to troika
5. changes to iron slug
6. changes to ionized salt bomb
7. changes to azure guardian armor
8. changes to crap SL armor
9. changes to shadowsun
10. changes to bombastic armor
And a lot more. You know... at least something useful which we have been asking for?
And no this is not a suggestion topic. 1. I actually want it to be read and 2. we are discussing the purpose of this patch other than adding promos to make spiral knights more advertise and make money knights.
someone needs to do some explaining, simply because we are confused and baffled.
Edit: DANGIT I messed up the title. Makes it sound like I am displeased that the change matches with brandishes. I fixed the title. Dangit.
Just stop discriminating shovels and other tools. They have the same right to explode as a sword.
The glacius/etc buff was good. It made the other elemental swords more in line with DA. Though 4 explosions would have been fine.
But buffing the weaker swords was just pointless.The-Rawrcake is right, they need to work on the pointlessly outclassed weapons. In addition to the changes he stated, they need 5* upgrades to all weapons that stop at 4* for no real reason (winmillion, radiant sun shards, etc)
"Just stop discriminating shovels and other tools. They have the same right to explode as a sword."
NO. Explosions are what made the Brandishes Unique. They deserve to be Hacking & Slashing at T1 Depth Crystal, not Asploding.
i'm glad they got buffed. now they aren't just an inferior choice to DA for everything elem damage related.
but agreed. they should be bufffing certain guns (or all gunnering) and useless bombs.
*dons monocle* When I first read the buffs for the peasant weapons, I was disheartened and left wondering if this was the "item balance" talked about. Fortunately, I do not believe this is so (if it is, someone do post a link to a GM's statement). If I may,
"Some item balance changes are on the way. Specifically this will target items that require tweaks to have their stats stand apart from similar ones and some changes to handguns to make them more varied and viable in combat. Check the forums for notice of these changes before they happen."
--Nick
Fortunately, the "tweaks" that the update brought didn't set any sort of stats apart from other weapons. If anything, it made weapons more similar, which makes me believe that this isn't the fabled "item balance." Furthermore, the guns weren't altered in any way, so this adds to my hopes and dreams that the things you mentioned may still be "balanced."
I think the peasant items were buffed first because of their lack-of-impact on the game. Aside from Lockdown and the first week or so of game playing, they offer very little. Thus there was very little risk to giving them a fancy little 'pop.' However, if this was the "fabled balance," then I will charge my butlers and maids with the order to join you in rioting while I sit perched on my balcony, sipping various drinks and polishing my monocle collection. Rioting is so much more fun when you're not getting your hands dirty.
No need to riot. All we need is some kind of response that confirms there is more on its way than this. I have a feeling the devs would understand what we want if they read suggestions instead of discussing promos / marketting? I don't know, whatever devs do in their free time / work time.
"i'm glad they got buffed. now they aren't just an inferior choice to DA for everything elem damage related."
Ok, what about wild hunting blade? How does that compare to, say, BTB or flourish against beasts?
Some actually preferred brandishes over DA.
What about a weapon like irontech destroyer? It is literally a nitronome just way worse. It COULD be made an elemental bomb with no knockback like the DBB but how about better 1 and 0 star items, hmm?
Brandish was unique in comparison to DA at the start. Brandishes did not need to be buffed. We need to fix our priorities.
Especially because we are buffing 0 and 1 star weapons.
And don't forget the armor. There are a number of things that really need changed, buffed, or even nerfed. The last thing we need to do is hide behind promotions and ignore new content as well.
I am aware there has been a "January" or whatever list of future things, but remember when the devs suggested AP and Sent? By "handguns to make them more varied and viable in combat" I hope they mean "we will finally stop making promos about games other than this game for Sega and get to the important things actually for the better of the game itself instead of $$$"
I am begging on my hands and kn.... my computer chair.
They're just starting off slow, they'll get to the other ones soon.
Well, uh, changing those items you mentioned could have a major affect on gameplay. It's likely the devs want to do internal and closed testing BEFORE releasing them onto the main game world. I'm fairly sure Nick mentioned somewhere that the changes were going to be applied to the test server first, for feedback. (He said "Keep an eye on the testing forum" or something akin to that.)
The 0* and 1* weapons, on the other hand, don't have a huge effect on gameplay as a whole (as they can only be used on T1, are quickly left behind, etc.), so they could go ahead and push those on though without problem.
As for the Brandish buff, it's likely they pushed that one though without closed beta testing because they wanted to allow the Brandish lines to better compete with the likes of the DA and GF, ie, "Why would I pick X over Y."
EDIT: Not to say that the Brandish buff didn't need any testing before release. Probably would have been good to get some community feedback first.
I hope these balances are coming soon.
Like right now, the Iron slug sucks, and so does the ionized salt bomb, and like 30000000+ weapons...
If OOO could buff a sword line that was already viable and used by people over DA without testing... I have a feeling they could buff ItD and BAB and chaos armor without testing.
All it is is messed up priorities.
The most messed up thing is the buffing of the 0 and 1 star items by far. Because there have been tons of threads asking for those to get buffed. That is exactly what we have been asking for....
Buffing 0 and 1 star items sounds like some random update. Not an update where there has been no new content for how long?
Take shadow lairs for example. We wanted new content for a long time, and then came shadow lairs with copied bosses just changed a little, easy to implement and make money off of those willing to drop big $$$ for SK. People were very mad, unenjoyable "content"
Then, their recent update, they buff 0 and 1 star items. Once again its like what we want is not the priority... I just don't get it.... it's like... WHY??? 0 and 1 star???
Answers xO I'm too baffled I want to know the intentions of whatever this is
@Everyone so confused and weirded out about the shovel/pickaxe:
"Omg a SHOVEL EXPLODES?"
What sword have you ever seen irl that creates explosions? If you're gunna question one, question them all. As things are, NONE of them make sense, so don't get picky over some.
@OP:
Actually, I think the 0/1* weapons benefited from the buff. Since they only get 2 explosions it's not like they can just stand miles back, and the damage is still low in T1, so it gives the noobles a wee hand, rather than big swing attacks that can get you killed.
I said it when the Brandish charge happened, I agree completely that it just didn't need it. I've always been happy with my Glacius charge and ever since the patch...I don't really take advantage of the 5 'splosions thing, I don't stand any farther back; there's just no need. Was fine as it was.
I'm not sure why they're buffing up weapons that are already fine.
I'm hoping that it's a plan of theirs that they're being ill-decidedly quiet about, to boost several of the other weapons in ways that take more time, and they're pre-emptively changing some current weapons (in small ways that don't take as much time/effort) to balance them out, so when the balances for weapons such as Suda come out, that the brandish line and such aren't thrown in the dirt for suddenly becoming UP.
Hoping.
Ionized salt bomb isn't bad for soloing JK, and the Azure Guardian armor isn't really terrible.
Gotta agree with those other choices though, especially since I want to buy an Iron Slug ;/
"Ionized salt bomb isn't bad for soloing JK"
It's a piercing bomb...
I think that its great that they buffed the brandish line, which they should leave the way they are right now. :)
However, I do think its weird to add explosions to these lower swords, its The Troika line and some others that really need to be buffed.
It's piercing + elemental, and does bonus damage to slimes, which compensates for it. Plus, putting it in the middle of JK makes it hurt.
"What sword have you ever seen irl that creates explosions? If you're gunna question one, question them all. As things are, NONE of them make sense, so don't get picky over some."
Actually, the thing about the brandishes and their explosions was because they were supposed to contain an elemental energy in the blade itself, which is released in a burst when charged (My theory)
A shovel, however...is just a shovel.
No offense.
But in all seriousness, this was my reaction:
ZOMG WAT? OOO is slowly turning all gear into brandish wannabes!?
It's not piercing + elemental. It's normal + piercing, with a slime bonus. (What the heck is a slime bonus there for?)
You're thinking of the radiant sun shards, which IS piercing + elemental, with a fiend bonus.
Both suck vs the Royal Jelly. Ionized was always terrible because it's charge time was longer then a sword's, and DBB annihilated it in terms of damage, AoE, and most definitely charge time.
RSS was a great bomb for the Royal Jelly before the patch that gave it the defenses of a regular slime.
Must have missed that patch then, my bad. Either way, buffs wouldn't be bad xD
@Green-Meep You are confused. The (Radiant) Sun Shards are Piercing/Elemental, and used to be the go-to bomb for killing the Royal Jelly, since he was previously a classless monster with no meaningful damage strengths/weaknesses. I believe the RSS would do somewhere in the range of 90-100 damage per shard, so you could get off 800 or so damage every ~1.5 seconds with a bit of CTR. However, he is now a slime and so is resistant to the pierce portion of the bomb.
The Ionized salt bomb, on the other hand is a split pierce/normal weapon with an abnormally long charge time and a completely meaningless buff vs slime. It has never been a go-to weapon for beating the Royal Jelly as RJ was previously not a slime class monster, the chance to shock was not valued, and the abnormally long charge time left you far too vulnerable and killed your DPS compared with the RSS. It is not currently a go-to weapon for killing the Royal Jelly since RJ now resists pierce, and the slime bonus on the bomb doesn't even bring it up to neutral damage (ie: it does less damage to slime than it does to gremlin or undead).
Using the ISB, you would be lucky to do maybe 450 damage every 3 seconds or so, assuming you have a CTR buff. For comparison, the FoV charge attack will do 600 damage every 1.5 seconds or so and set RJ on fire, or if you have a levi you can get about 550 in the same amount of time, and a well placed Acheron charge will get you about 580. Even a Voltedge will do almost 500 damage on a charge and inflict strong shock rather than the ISB's moderate shock.
So are we all in agreement...
OOO has messed up priorities...
Anyways about the update itself...
1. Their game is not new player friendly. That is too obvious, it's made that way as it is a way for them to make $$. How unprofitable tier 1 is and such. Why is OOO prioritizing new players?
2. Most new players don't even go after 1 and 0 star items. They go straight to 2* items.
3. The charge attacks aren't even used that often, not by new players as they are new nor people in T1 LD.
4. Your majority have been wanting item balance among the gear the majority actually would consider using.
What the heck was their intention making the update anyway????
So now we have a useless update and messed up priorities?
We need answers NAOW
ok I think I've been trolled enough
000 why? bradishes where special? now proto sword can explode! Change it back plz?
/beg
my combuster is crying!
/beg
You're mistaken. RSS was and is still great against the RJ, last I checked. It does maybe 60+ damage per shard (easily dealing 500+ per bomb). The reason less people use it now is because the boss the doesn't heal nearly as much as it used to, and it hits you without warning if you get close, for some reason.
The problems with ISB are not only the pointless slime bonus, but the fact that it's pretty much the SLOWEST bomb in the game.
@Batabii The RSS should only be doing about 55 per shard without damage bonuses. Obviously it'll be more with a max damage buff, but so will the alternatives with their respective damages maxed. That only gives you 440 for all 8 shards, just a little under what I guesstimated the ISB to deliver (though with double the effective DPS on the RSS due to the charge time differences). It's still a far cry from the 7-800 it used to do, and the head-butting makes it really risky to plant one close enough to get all 8 shards to hit, especially with the short fuse on the RSS.
Just for comparison-lulz, using BTB charge attacks on RJ gives 12x8 (spikes) + 34 (charge swipe) + 22 (first swipe of next charge) = 152 damage per charge. If we assume that we can do two BTB charges in the time it takes to do one ISB, that gives it an effective damage of 304 vs ~450 if you're really lucky for the ISB.
Challenge-lulz time: Someone record an RJ solo using only the BTB and post it to youtube. (I can't do it myself, I've only got a DTB)
I dont understeand why OOO is doing such not important updates. We have already susggested many improvments to the game which would make gameplay experience better for ALL PLAYERS, and what we get?
A silly updates which make experience better for only part of players since they affect specific weapons.
Also it seems OOO is making updates out of nowhere, i barely found a topic about how brandishes are unfair etc.
We need more updates that will be for every player, that will not affect weapons but overall gameplay like cleaning out situation with chat system (aka tabbed chat), guild notices and other that will help most of players enjoy game more, NOT an updates that affect certain weapons and making update directed only to narrow group of ppl using that specific weapon.
I'll take a screenshot next time I solo there, but honestly, I still think RSS yields greater DPS than any non-shadow weapon on the Royal Jelly...
Ugh lets quit discussing RSS, what about the update?
I have to be missing something big if it is the devs #1 priority to add that update about 0 and 1 stars.
Does anyone know something that I don't about the update??? Am I missing something? If someone does please say below I'm still confused.
@Batabii According to the damage numbers on the wiki it doesn't do more damage than either the FoV charge or the Voltedge/Comb/Glac charge (Elemental) nor the Levi charge (Normal). If those numbers are incorrect, feel free to update them.
I think he did not mean the instant damage of the RSS - damage over time, which is DPS
Though I don't believe it kills RJ/JK faster than a FoV ... that wouldn't be right at all.
Great, now I'm discussing RSS
Tell that to a Fang of Vog.
@The-Friedcake When I right-click on your name to look at the things that come up since your name isn't a word, I come up with that.
It's LULZ.
That how in the HOLY MOTHER OF BUTT DOES A SHOVEL ASPLODE!?!?!?!!1!1!?!1?!!!/!!?1!/!!?