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Time to get back into Gunslinging - new set time!

6 replies [Last post]
Tue, 09/25/2012 - 05:14
Darkbrady's picture
Darkbrady

So, have spent most of my SK life as a bomber/hybrid and have been starting to eye up the very brief time I tried being a gunner, especially now that gunners have had a few buffs here and there so it definitely feels more worth it! So, have thrown together a new set and am testing it out, to see how well I can fare. The set layout itself I'm fairly confident about, but am still unsure about guns, partially due to inexperience with them and knowing (from personal use) which ones will work best. So, I went with a mix!

Armour:
Seerus Mask
Shadowsun Slicker
Swifty
Trueshot Trinky (x2)

Guns:
V.Pepperbox (asi:low)
Blitz Needle (ctr:med)
Storm Driver (ctr:med)
Sentenza

In total, this gives all my guns max damage, v.high asi and med ctr. The Blitz and Storm have max ctr and the Pepperbox has ultra asi. The Sent has no UV yet, as I built this in my earliest days then abandoned it when I realised that pierce/shadow was an awful combo.

Overall, I have a mix of all four types, so I'm never at a loss, and any one of these can be replaced with a side-knife should I want/need one during a floor (since I won't need 3 types), and a mix of stand-shoot and move-shoot, high and low clips, and varied charge attacks. The Autoguns both have ridiculously high charge damage (1k5+); the Pepperbox being more than capable of onehitting anything that looks at me funny and the Blitz being a Trojan/Vana/wolver solver.

I've gone with the Sent over Umbra because I feel it's better for Gremlins and makes no difference to Slimes as it still kills them fairly fast. I went with Storm for the shock, preferring that over freeze (considering that the shots will just break the ice, whereas shock remains) and my pepperbox already has fire. I was torn between that and Prisma for the extra damage, but decided that between the two Autoguns, I'm already pulling redundant damage when I need it, so chose to have the status over some more damage I really don't think I need.

But of course, my experience as a gunner was from long ago, and quite brief, and now am just getting back into the swing of things, but with the mindset of a bomber. I'm finding myself standing far too close to enemies and making an effort to use the pepperbox's spread for area damage or assassinations rather than safely at the back. And of course, with my armour I only have half shadow/ele defence and no piercing defence to speak of, and my shield is about as reliable in a fight as shaking a stick at the baddies. But I guess some experience in running circles around enemies helps this, at least.

Basically, just looking for some of the thoughts of those more well-versed in gunning than myself. S'good fun playing about with new classes, but a suggestions on either playstyle of loadouts can never hurt :)

Tue, 09/25/2012 - 06:37
#1
Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

I'd actually consider going for hail driver if I were you. That would let you freeze things so that you could follow them up with a pepperbox charge, landing all of the shots safely.

Keep everything the way you've got it, but then add hail driver into the mix and use it in place of whichever damage type you won't be using much, most likely blitz. This will also let you rapid fire drivers should you so choose, and would let you both single things out with hail driver and compact the crowd with storm driver. Alternatively you *could* switch out storm driver for it and maintain your 3 damage type balance thing that you've got going on, at very little cost. Hail driver is under rated, IMO.

Another consideration is that umbra driver benefits from CTR way more than sentenza does... meaning that you might want to switch over to that, although its more a matter of preference. When I gun, I usually focus on maxing out either ASI or CTR and plan my guns around that. I know I'll never use the derpy sentenza/argent peacemaker charge, so I go for ASI with those; whereas with drivers/autoguns I usually go for CTR (and ASI second), which seems to be what you're going for, although I think that as a pure gunner you're fairly optimal with this loadout.

The only other consideration I would have for you would be to consider neutralizer/biohazard, although to be honest I don't think it'd be worth mastering those in the first place. Sure, they'd benefit perfectly from this CTR set, and they could easily be the best (support) guns in the game if you were able to master them, but they're just so hard to use that it isn't worth it most of the time, and its far more than "getting the hang of it" with them. Like with a driver, you just have to practice a few levels, and you can fight with it. With biohazard, you have to master the timing of everything, and then master the dodge patterns and AI etc etc. And even then, you're still going to have to practice a good deal with it.

I'll have to try to catch you when you're using this set, I'd like to see it in action.

Tue, 09/25/2012 - 06:46
#2
Darkbrady's picture
Darkbrady
I was thinking about Hail, I

I was thinking about Hail, I just couldn't justify to myself such a temporary status effect; it'd be broken the second I shot again, and when I want to Pepperblast, I never have any problems getting the charge in on moving enemies anyways. As a bomber, freeze worked for me because it was essentially spammable, and the damage got done at the same time, but for this I feel like I'd be freezing them just to lose the effect straight away. I in no way think the gun itself is bad, I just don't feel it'd fit with my strategy, whereas I can send in a shock and let them stutter around while I shoot them.
Could be completely wrong here, I've not had much time to play about with it, but that's my rationale behind it anyways. Ofc, I do like the idea of using both, as I don't expect to be carrying all four types into every floor.

The Sent charge definitely is only useful against polyps I find, basically useless since it has no KB, roots you, not enough damage to ohko etc...Umbra would be nice, but then I'd only really be crafting it for another charge that I don't need, and it'd be worse off on Gremlins. However, for pvp I'd like an Umbra; it may be my imagination, but Sent/Pepper seem to have their range totally nerfed in pvp , I can hardly get a bullet two feet in front of me...

The Biohazard I looked at briefly and forgot about, mainly becasue I thought "meh, already have a shadow gun", but I forgot that it has its own interesting mechanic. I was looking at it when it came out and was interested, but have never touched the thing at all. If it is that much of a problem to learn, I might just wait till I've finished playing about with this set and have my bearings, then look into it as a replacement for Sent. Neutraliser I completely forgot about, mind you...

Tue, 09/25/2012 - 07:16
#3
Bopp's picture
Bopp
that's my experience

My experience with Hail Driver was that the regular shots might as well not freeze, because subsequent shots and ricochets will just unfreeze anyway. But this was over a year ago, before I switched to charge-heavy tactics. Alchemer users like charges, and maybe Hail users especially like charges? Perhaps Fehzor can comment.

Tue, 09/25/2012 - 14:13
#4
Atacii
...

For charge spamming Alchemers, nothing beats a Hail Driver, as unless you are the ricochet master, freeze will help you to clip enemies and otherwise effectively place your charges.

Against large mobs it helps clump enemies as well. Freeze the mob in front while those behind continue moving forward.

If you are going to bring only one alchemer for regular shooting, Hail isn't a bad choice. Just allow enemies to thaw when you can. Not so good for swap shooting though.

I would consider swapping a trueshot for a focus. And Blitz is better against Gremlins than a Sentenza.

Tue, 09/25/2012 - 20:20
#5
Fehzor's picture
Fehzor

Hail driver:
-Does better damage if they thaw, like atacii said
-Essentially does double damage if you are able to freeze them and then follow it up with another charge attack. This can then lead into a thaw.
-Is able to take out trojans better than other alchemers due to the freeze combined with the above. Shoot once (or around a corner if you're lucky) and then freeze the trojan; follow up with 2-3 charges to deal massive damage.
-Is best for direct crowd manipulation, like Atacii says.
-Works well with other ice weapons; if they're shivering, you can charge attack multiple times to kill specific targets... though glacius pulls it off better. Also keep in mind that by "ice weapons" I'm referring to all weapons that benefit from ice, like blitz needle, warmaster rocket hammer... I've made note of these here- http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/61167

Copied from another thread where I commented-
Nova: Best for single target damage VS enemies lacking shields that are not weak to umbra
Storm: Best for large groups of enemies that are close together and move often; works well with magma; best general crowd control
Magma: Best for turrets and large groups of enemies that do not clump together; works well with storm
Hail: Best for single targets that shield and healers; works well in conjunction with other ice themed items; best deliberate crowd control

Wed, 09/26/2012 - 01:27
#6
Darkbrady's picture
Darkbrady
I would consider swapping a

I would consider swapping a trueshot for a focus. And Blitz is better against Gremlins than a Sentenza.

the two charge weapons already have max ctr with their UVs, and I don't use Sent's charge. I've been considerin' switchin' out pepperboxs UV to ctr as well, though.
Never tried Blitz against gremlins actually. I use pepperbox when there;s a crowd of them or the darkfangs, if for no other reason than to just push them all back and give me some space. Will give blitz a shot, though~

For turrets I've never really had a problem, as even in a party of 4, peppercharge can onehit them while cancelling their attack, so not really been thinking about another weapon for that purpose.

For the hail I'd be interested in trying out, but I'm still a bit anxious about rooting them; I like to switch between my [chosen weapon] and pepperbox regularly; in this case I sent out a few volt charges, get the group shocked and mumbling around, then a peppercharge to KB them all while killing half of them. If they were frozen, the shock damage wouldn't spread and the pepper charge would just release them to their full walking speed. I just find this method both faster and safer than purely spamming the voltech, as the damage from that just doesnae compare to peppercharges, especially when that gets fire in as well.
How would you suggest implementing a Hail into that, if I did grab one and give it a shot?

Also keeping in mind that I'm by no means a ricochet master! I've had my pepperbox for some time and know what I'm doin' with that, but am completely new to alchemers~

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