I told my best friend on Spiral Knights that I'm pay-to-play and now he doesn't trust me anymore, so is there anything wrong with that?
Pay-to-players are the ones who bought crystal energy to put it in the market for free-to-players so I don't see an issue if that helped them.
I don't brag about it to anyone. I just bought a couple of energy for crafting.
Unless your buying it with a promo, yes you're a bad person.
Some people can't spend money on this game for some reason or another (usually because their parents won't let them), so they get upset when other people can buy their way to 5* clearance and whatnot. Other people believe spending no money on this game makes it a challenge.
You're not a bad person for spending money on this game. The devs for sure thank you :D
"I don't brag about it to anyone. I just bought a couple of energy for crafting."
I wasn't assuming you were, no worries.
There's also the whole 'P2W' concept too. Most people like to think P2P=P2W.
Unless it's going towards the "Make bushes a bigger part of the game" fund, I say you shouldn't pay a dime for that useless CE....Well, It's worthless to us bushes, Considering we can't CE revive, And we can't have mustaches....Hint hint Nick, Take it for Pete's sake!
Gremlins need a hug too :3 We can mutate more bushes, with mustaches!~
Anyways, gremlins are too poor to buy energy. Trying not to stereotype, but usually the p2w concept is somewhat harmful. Experience over gear.
SK is fairly casual compared to many games, so I don't see much reason to pay money on it. I did get OCH with a gift card during the Steam winter sale, but I have never paid for energy. I don't mind P2P players; I thank them for reducing the CE prices during promos and sales, but I still marvel at how much some would spend on something like SK.
I'm a believer that if you are a huge fan of any game, it's a nice gesture to show support for said game by helping to keep the game in business. Whether that's by purchasing in-game gear, donating to the company, or in another way, you're allowing the game to continue to exist.
People who firmly believe in this whole FTP way of life with no room to ever want to purchase anything are the the "bad" ones, if we're trying to pick one group being "bad" or the other.
I personally spend much more time playing Spiral Knights than I do playing games I pay $20-$60 on a console, therefore I think it is a fair trade off to buy something every couple months and make my contribution to keeping the game going.
Don't ever listen to anyone who thinks being a paying player is a 'bad' thing. They're extremely ignorant.
Pay to play and Pay to win are 2 different things.
Pay to play IMO is that you have the experience, and you pay for some extra energy or crowns. Pay to win are the ignorant ones whereby they pay to get energy to straight away craft to 5 star and whatsoever. Please pause to learn more about the game.
"People who firmly believe in this whole FTP way of life with no room to ever want to purchase anything are the the "bad" ones, if we're trying to pick one group being "bad" or the other."
The game needs a balance of FTP and PTP players because of how the economy of the game works.
FTP play to farm crowns, which in turn exchanges for energy from PTP. FTP also farm crowns to buy stuff from the AH, some of which can only be gained from PTP players (such as crown of winter etc. etc.)
I was free to play up until the halfway-ish point of turning my 4 star gear into 5 star gear. I decided to buy some CE, simply because I could not take grinding, and things were starting to get boring. Now I'm not one of those people who pump insane amounts of cash into this game. But I'd much rather have a life, and completed school assignments in exchange for a small amount of money. Yeah, I'm such an insane evil person for being like that.
The one ironic thing that strikes me is how there are so many F2Pers out there who think spending money on a game is a ridiculous idea, even though:
1. There has to be people paying for energy or otherwise you couldn't be free to play, and
2. They probably have spent money on a game somewhere sometime, be it a playstation game, a nintendo game or even a trading card game.
I don't have anything wrong with paying money for the game. Admittedly I get a touch depressed when I see armor that has every volcanic, divine, shadow and prismatic accessory possible arbitrarily stapled to it, for that to me screams "Look at me! I have too much money and no sense of style!" When you say that you have spent money on the game, people tend to automatically lump you into the aforementioned category (in addition to tacking on the assumption that you didn't "earn" your gear).
Now your friend on the other hand... I would hesitate to call anyone a friend if they suddenly think less of you for spending money on the game... albeit it depends on the amount spent. If you spent like $5-$20, I'd slap them across the face and ignore them. If you spent $50+, then you're straying a bit on the excessive side.
"If you spent like $5-$20, I'd slap them across the face and ignore them. If you spent $50+, then you're straying a bit on the excessive side."
Don't forget to take time-frame into account.
Well I'm assuming in a single purchase. The way the OP phrased it, sounds like after one purchase the guy kinda turned on the OP.
u know,wat if its ur birthday and u get something like the expansion and a bit of ce as a gift? are u a bad person cuz it was ur birthday?
@Spold: Yeah that ain't that unreasonable. Isn't the monthly subscription fee for most MMO's $20+ anyways?
I admit to spending some cash on this game because I am committed to this game to the point were I wanted the DLC. I also find just paying 5 bucks is totally worth not having to pay for elevators and hay, these developers work hard and obviously look into what the community says and even take the time to read through the rough to find the gems.
It wasn't my birthday, it was because I got good grades on my report card. I don't use credit cards or anything like that. I use Ultimate Game Cards and prepaid cards.
I dont see anything wrong with being P2P.
You support the game you like, and you get some CE. Maybe some extra items on promos.
There's nothing wrong with P2P
P2P are supporting OOO just like F2Ps, if no one bought CE/dump money into this game there will be no such a game.
Developers need to make money too. It's a business after all.
If you love games why not buy in game goods or support the game? For example I love Touhou and am telling more people about it. So that people are aware and then the developers generally get more feedback.
Of course, I didn't skip all the way to five stars. I crafted up to four stars and I wasn't tired of grinding Royal Jelly Palace or Ironclaw Munitions Factory, I never have time to do that because I can finish my homework quickly, believe me however every time I get off of my bus from school I get dropped over at my grandfather's house and I have to wait until 8:00 PM for my mother to get off of work and I can't always stay up late grinding. That's why I'm pay-to-play. I didn't skip all the way to five stars like being $100 crystal energy then crafting all three star and four star to get to five star. I only spent $20 for crafting since I didn't have much time for grinding, I didn't do any fast crafting. Even though I bought that crystal energy, I tried to heat my gear and get a proper amount of crowns for crafting.
Some players just may buy things from the supply depot with $50 or something. It had to take me at least three months to get to four stars so I decided to put a little cash in the game because I knew I wouldn't have time to grind all the time.
Besides, you're right. Without pay-to-players, this game would NOT exist. There couldn't be free-to-players without pay-to-players and the developers wouldn't have enough money to keep up the business.
I don't think there's a reason to put a "TL;DR" sentence because this is not really that long.
I would say that's a good thing.
Without P2Pers, the F2Pers would be:
I have met certain P2Pers who act like douchebags, but that's hardly a representative of all P2Pers, and I am reasonably sure there's an equivalent proportion of F2Pers who act in a similar fashion.
Personally, I would say that your 'best friend' is being an idiot. Whether you pay or not has no bearing on the kind of person you are, and suddenly shunning someone just because they spent a few bucks on the game is ridiculous.
Ok...
Maybe 20-25 dollars, but any more than that i think it would just ruin the fun of the game...
I've spent five bucks on this game and i've got nearly every gun in the game...
Its not an extremely hard game to complete, even so. It might get a bit frustrating not
Having enough ce so you buy some, fine! Pay to play players (lol... Try say that 10 times quickly...)
Are just as nice, and... Well you get the drift...
Sword
The reason why I think my friend had a problem with me is he probably thought that I was a pay-to-win player who just rushes to five star without any experience.
You mentioned that he was your friend.
I don't know how you do things, but generally I find myself playing with my friends on various occasions. If he's your 'best' friend, then that would further imply that you should know each other fairly well. Therefore, for him to make a judgement on your personality based on the fact that you decided to purchase some CE would be absurd.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being P2P. Many people prefer spending money in order to progress rather then investing the amount of time F2P players need to put into this game to get to the same point. While this might cause some resentment, it's what funds the game and the progress of every F2P player upgrading further than 2*.
The freemium model is a great thing if done right, meaning paying players gain access to mostly aesthetic enhancements and are able to progress at a much faster rate while still allowing non-paying players to acquire the same gameplay relevant gear and accessing the same content. This doesn't give P2P players a significant advantage in the game (aka pay-to-win) as they still need the same experience to make the most of the gear they buy within a couple of days as the F2P players that work on obtaining the same gear in a larger amount of time (gaining said experience along the way.)
OOO has implemented this model almost flawlessly. I'm saying almost as you're certainly aware of the (arguably sad) state of OCH availability for F2P players not using Steam. Making this content available for everyone was suggested from day one ("We're working on it, honestly!") while after nearly a year OOO hasn't made good on their promise or even issued any further statement while the same content is sold for CE on the Asian servers - voiding the possible argument that it's not achievable from a technological standpoint. This is a major flaw in the freemium model as I'd like it to see implemented and it saddens me to say that I hold this not only against OOO but also against the P2P players purchasing the expansion knowing perfectly well that not everyone is entitled to enjoying the same content and reaping the same benefits (i.e. the gear and the chance of selling the masks at what I assume is quite a profit.)
Maybe 20-25 dollars, but any more than that i think it would just ruin the fun of the game...
I reckon the inverse is true, if you know what you're doing with your money.
I use what I spend on the game to upgrade equipment slowly (I allocate myself a budget in the game) and I often use it to replace regular grindy levels (FSC and RJP) with levels that I'd rather play (random parties in the clockworks)
Paying for the game makes it more fun for me because I can still get crown in the game while running non-repetitive yet non-profitable levels.
@Spold
Maybe he's jealous? :3
Personally I think being P2P is something you should be happy about! Not only can you play longer (unless of course, you didn't buy CE, lets say you bought OCH) and you have benefited the developers ^^ Its a win-win situation! ^^
It's not a bad thing in particular but I wouldn't call it a good thing either.
I don't like the idea of people thinking whether someone's f2p or p2p >.<
The only time I can think of when being p2p is a bad thing is when someone squanders all their ce. By squander, I don't mean selling all that ce to buy some cosmetic item worth millions, punching UV's and not letting all that ce you bought last even a day, or even finding out how many FoV charges it takes to kill Vana. People usually know what they're doing and that's fine by all means. I mean buying that FoV ASI VH for ~20kce thinking "it's the best possible sword in the game" only to find that you're using your Blazebrand more often. *shudders*
....
Basically what Hex said about so long as you know what you're doing with your money.
No. Nothing is wrong with being a paying player. Absolutely nothing at all. In fact, buying energy makes the game less grind-heavy, making it an overall better experience. Grind-fanatics may state otherwise, but keep in mind that not all of us enjoy grind-heavy games.
Personally, I have probably spent somewhere in the thousands. Yes, thousands. My friends either tell me I'm crazy to be spending this much, that I must be rich, or that I must be a complete idiot to spend that much on an online game that can otherwise be played for free. To that I say the following:
What I do with my own money is none, I repeat, none of your business. It is ultimately my decision where I put my money and nobody else gets to have a say on the matter. So long as I deem it a worthwhile investment it is in my best interest that I act accordingly and disregard any opposition to that action from by-standers. It is none of their business.
Some of you may be asking, "why would you spend so much?"
To which I answer, I love this game. I genuinely enjoy playing this game, and I want to see it grow, and as such I am willing to donate my money so that the game can continue to grow so that I can love it all the more when the occasional update rolls around. You could say I have a passion for this game, and I would hope that other paying players share this passion so that we can all contribute to the game's evolution.
This is why he's mad at me. We got into an argument because I asked him "Why do you hate pay-to-players?" and now I left my guild because we're in the same one and if one person disrespects me in a guild, then I can't live with it even though everyone else respects me. He WAS a good friend but now I don't want to see him ever again.
The game relies on paying players. Someone has to pay for those crystal energies otherwise we would all be running on mist tanks. I would actually be thankful for players like Shidara. Even more so if he's on all the time. I would hate to log in to an empty server. This is because of the way the CE system was designed, so based on this I really don't see the negativity of paying players unless they are rubbing it in your face. Any advantage they purchase is rightfully earned. Not everyone would be willing to pay for it and based on the responses on here, that's like most of us.
I haven't spent a lot on the game, starter pack when i was nearly 5* as I couldn't take the grinding, guardian armor pack when it was at a great discount, some elevator passes and OCH.
I have to say that by spending more time on this game and spending low sums; bellow £100 I think, didn't bother to keep count, I have actually saved money as I would otherwise used it to buy ps3 games throughout the last 2 years for nearly £40 each and play the game for a week and never touch it again... I would say that I have saved in the hundreds of £'s, probably close to a thousand and have had much more fun overall :p
Also remember that if people like Shidara that helps out a lot with funds, or even if no one bought any CE, everyone would be running around in 2* as you can only have 100 mist D:
@Minotower
Yeah, thanks for listing positive aspects of being pay-to-play.
Supporting the game is always a good thing. And the developers have done a good job making sure that paying players don't have any unfair advantages.
Pay to play myself...why is it a bad thing? It is a good thing! If no one pay how can OOO run the game and make it better?
People who think that all pay to play player have no skill is just dumb, just ignore people like that...
It is easier for pay to play players to be successful. This is a truth.
"It is easier for pay to play players to be successful. This is a truth."
Well, not necessarily. It all goes to how you define success in this game. If you pay to get energy to rush to 5 star, then you are missing a lot of experience and the type of gameplay gap makes it harder to adapt to the higher level of difficulty. Although the missions are there to guide you, there are still, yet still, some players who can't adjust... yes there are.
Well, if we go by that logic.
''People who think that all pay to play player have no skill is just dumb''
Then this sentence is not necessarily incorrect.
There's a big difference between “pay to play” and “super-rich kid who drops $200 and is loaded for the rest of his SK career”.
I've probably spent about $5 on ce, and another $5 on OCH. That makes me “pay to play”.
But either way, it's those rich types that keep the game ALIVE so that you can play it at all. Someone's gotta pay the bills.
There will always be people against something, whether it is an in-game purchase or not liking cottage cheese. You like it enough to put money into it, and that requires dedication to both the game and the company. This scenario can be put multiple ways for me.
When I like a game I usually decide how much I like the game, then I will put that amount into the game. When it came to Spiral Knights, it was roughly $30-40 (a little extra as gifts to friends.) For other games that will not be mentioned it sometimes ranged from $15-400 (MMO subscriptions.) If I didn't like it I would have stopped and move on.
This can even be put in non-game situations. I'm a Sword collector in RL, so obviously I'll make Sword purchases both online and off. My whole family thinks it is a complete waste, but it makes me happy. Doesn't make them too thrilled, but they'll just have to suck it up, lol!
I do not have the time to grind all day. Shut up and take my money instead.
^ is why it isn't a bad thing.
#TeraKnowsThis
During a full 1000 hours of gameplay, OOO took one year of gaming away from me in a single game.
Granted I usually buy 10 to 20 games per year, 2011 didn't cost me much in term of games because I was always on SK and on Saints Row 3.
Considering I have a job and I am a "hardcore" gamer, I don't think spending 200$ on SK was a bad thing. It even helped them produce the content you are enjoying right now.
F2P is nice because you play a game for free, after 500 hours you kinda don't mind giving them 20$ in exchange of a elevator free pass and couple CE to craft your cool gear.
Whether you think it's a bad thing or not doesn't concern me but I had to log in to say this.
I'm F2P on TF2 and P2P on SK, I don't see the problem... 1000 hours on SK and 140 hours on TF2...
Edit: P2P is a nice way of saying thanks to the dev's. P2W is the devs milking you...
IMO, there's nothing wrong with Pay to Play players.
People have issues with them because some think it's almost like cheating; you're buying an advantage etc.
Me, I have no issue. Unless asid player is a total idiot and rubbing in my face the hordes of CE and cr he has as well as all his '1337' gear while calling me a noob, and/or completely sucking at the game and/or blaming it all on lag or something. Then it annoys me.
Otherwise, nurp.