Even if the person wasn't aware of the advice that was given to him it's pretty much always fair mainly because in competitions both side get bombarded with all sorts of advice either from friends, sports couches (obviously not in SK) or we. Advice giving does not make the person win anyways.
f
Bleyken, read a little more carefully next time, you misunderstood my post (too lazy to explain). Also, my evidence is the chat in the video (you need a high res display to read it properly). Contri clearly tells Illu not to use bkc.
@Noct
Obviously Dark decides, hes the tournament head. To try to clarify my point, see my response to Drdovis below about tennis. I mean, I guess its fair (wasnt specified in the rules). I dont have enough evidence fo present Jleung's side of the story, but in the vid the advice seemed like a kind of underhanded assistance.
@Drdovis
Sports couches are awesome. And true, advice does not always make them win. But isn't the advice in this situation an advantage for illu?
I see your point. Though just to provide a counterexample tennis players can get disqualified if they receive coaching through hand symbols or other means while playing.
I guess in SK advice from friends is fair game. Seemed like an "under the radar" move that was pulled, but if you guys see it as fair then I guess it is.
Ill wait until Darkcub posts his opinion on this, since he obviously makes the call. But I am just posting my thoughts on the actions.
@Bleyken
To answer your question, I explicitly stated that it is NOT Illu's fault (re-read the post).
Secondly, think of it this way:
2 chess players are about to play for $10k.
A specator finds out, after watching 4 games, finds out that Player 1's strategy is to release the queen on the left hand side as soon as possible, and attack via left flanking. This is a tactic that Player 1 uses to win. Player 2 does not know this. Score is tied.
The spectator tells Player 2 about Player 1's strategy during a break (only he can hear). Player 2 now has an unfairly gained tactical advantage over player 1, since chess is a 1v1 game typically.
The correlation:
P1 is Jleung, P2 is Illu, Spec is Contri.
Specator is biased towards his guildmate, and therefore gives him advice under the table. Illu took the advice and changed into snarby (again, watch the video closely)' right after contri says to not use bkc. This is supposed to be a 1v1 tournament, and in any 1v1 (NOT TEAM) sport, its the individual ONLY. This means that other people cant help them.
Also, Jleung is not in Oracion.
I realize that this is trivial since its just a silly tournament in SK, but the underlying morals still should hold.
@Octaslash:
Again, you are trying too hard. The moment you compared SK to Chess was your breakdown, now stop.
After reading post 46-55 and before this ridiculous thing goes on I'd like to point out that switching from bkc + mercurial gave me less shock resistance. The only reason bkc is ever a bad choice is the status weakness. And pairing it up with mercurial resulted in having medium shock resistance. Fyi, that's the highest shock resistance I have on any load out at the moment. I switched to Snarby for the higher sword damage and still neutral shock resistance, also I had just noticed Jleung used umbra driver instead of one of his storm drivers. Making my snarby set more valuable if I don't get shocked.
As for Not-Ruby's adivce, I never changed my play style.
octa is kinda right and if you ask me it's not really fair either
illu should make his own choices and not have others help him
It's not theirillusion's fault, I mean he couldn't help it that others would give him tips, but the other teammates should know better
This would count of course for all others
@Theirillusion
I said like 4 times that it was NOT your fault. I am not blaming you. Relax.
@Dragneel You seem kinda slow, since you don't understand the point of the comparison. Try thinking and reading, instead of skimming and posting the first bit of nonsense that you think of.
Everyone but you (from what I can tell) understands what I am getting at. Get your head out of your butt and think, k?
How do you have the balls to call someone slow?
I called him slow. Does that offend you?
Do something about it.
I am relaxed.
Chess version of the 1v1:
Jleung threatens my king with his knight.
Contri: I like ponies.
I take his knight because it threatened my king, not because it has the form of a horse and because Contri likes ponies.
^That pretty much sums it up.
My apologies if I offended you Illu, I tried to make it clear that it was not your fault at all. I should have been more specific.
But yeah, I think you see where I am coming from. Though whether or not you knew during the 1v1 that the knight was the threat is the deciding factor of the magnitude of the advice.
Point is, the advice you received (again, not your fault) was insignificant, but the fact that aid was given in the 1v1 (as Jungle correctly pointed out) was my main point.
But whatever, good luck in the tournament
The fact that Chess is a very complex strategical game makes it unsuitable for comparison with Lockdown which to be frankly has no depth at all. Yes, there are techniques and tricks that you should be aware of in LD, but more than that, I don't think there is a place for strategies in such "game". Therefore, comparing getting "advice" in Chess is way different and incomparable to "advice" given in LD where every decent player knows the whole deal.
@Dragneel
Ok, that gif is just effin hilarious XD
2 lazy 2 make comeback, so ill end with have a nice day instead
Interested to see the winner of all this.
I nominate Skeptics, Skybradon, Remet, Icycute, Pwnswag and Ezho...... for the ALS Ice Bucket Challenge.
^Tourney's all filled up (see first page)
:(
There's supposed to be a "y" in there somewhere. I forget where though..
WTF was that shit Contri ?
And its to 5 kills in the same server , no to 3
I give him the autowin then. GG bley, win or I'll cut your legs.
AAlucard-Xz toggle test https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kofI9Utwjx4&feature=youtu.be
I wasn't toggling. It looks like i might have toggled, I get that. I'm disqualified for the suspicion, ok I get that too, little salty but whatever. But you don't have to act like I did use it, cuz i didnt, so there. I'll come back with a vid of me recording a game of rld, using a similar action using no at or toggle so i don't have to be branded an at simpleton or cheater.
Don't act like it can't be done... http://youtu.be/4GXY3zaDgLM
I should have known someone not recording their own match could be d/qed. I learned my lesson, I will be recording all 1v1s myself from now on.
Also, since you guys are really "looking" out for at, I think you should look closer at the placement of the third hit your calling out here. Correct me if Im wrong but does AT not direct you dead center of the person your striking? watch closer and you will see it was off center. I feel like if you guys are going to do tournaments which you yourselves record and look for at should need irrefutable evidence of someone using it, not just a guy switches directions mid combo and happening on his opponent. WATCH AGAIN and tell me you don't see me hit the left side of his/her body.
Alucard's first combo was dead straight. But when you think about it, it's not impossible to land it without AT because:
1: The opponent walked in a straight line. Gg.
2: The opponent was a chaos guard. A.K.A slow movement speed and barely any change in movement.
3: Muff walked in a straight line completely backwards from Alucard. You don't need any calculations, just literally combo where he was standing and he'd still hit when he moved.
When a person toggles, it's pretty much common sense that they would toggle every time they combo, (That is, if you think he did the first time).
Look at his second combo. Even when it hit, he stabbed him in his SIDE. It's not dead straight.
Indicates ~> No AT Toggle.
After watching Alucard's videos (Jealous of that FPS and 4bar. ._.)
-Lack of lag while even recording supports that it was hard to mess up a combo if it was accidental in any way.
-Alucard's probably wearing a High-VH ASI FF with MSI med. Most people don't know this, but MSI speeds up your character in almost every way, including ASI. It's barely noticeable in combat, however. Anyway, his combos are as fast a bending valiance shot. When you watch him shoot a valiance, he's hitting based on direction prediction. His combo can be seen as shooting a valiance in Muffin's direction, which would hit because Muffin didn't turn.
Cub I contest alucard's ban, you see that third hit of his Final Flourish into muffin-top has a close to negligible offset from muffin-top's hit box, if you slow it down you can see it. That's all you need to prove that it's not AT
At the very most I think a rematch is in order, or should have been done by the judges at the moment of suspicion. I find it strange his opponent was so quick to stop fighting and die just to try to call out AT instead of continuing to fight. I mean what? Was he looking for a hint of it the entire time for a free win?
Not only that, that moment would be a terrible moment to toggle. I mean using the final FF thrust on such a faraway opponent often never lands even with AT. It would be stupid to whip out the toggle at such an obvious moment, if he was toggling he would have used it when he had boost and was in a more dominant position to shield cancel and hide it, not spam a super duper obvious FF combo when he was not in huge danger or really close to the enemy at all. (His previous slashes were in no way AT.) It's more probable his fingers couldn't keep up and he accidentally comboed while keeping his aim on him. (or maybe he meant to combo? Pretty sure we can all land FF no-AT-comboes at one time or another, and this is just the final thrust.)
I myself have landed an entire FF combo on an enemy moving perpendicular to me with no AT a few times. And yes I am heavily experienced with AT if you ever saw me play with my no asi acheron and etc as a recon.
Once again I say there should be a rematch, unless we are fine with people holding bitter feelings over this when this is supposed to be fun. But hey, not my tournament.
(yes everything i said is under the idea that whether or not he used AT at 0:19 of the video doesnt matter because proving that was not AT doenst prove he didnt toggle at 0:17 in the video. What is being argued is the slowed down final Final Flourish thrust in the video at 0:17, please keep in mind.)
I can guarantee that was not AT.
The final swipe hit muffin (as someone above said) on the left side, it shanked him through his kidney instead of his stomAAch.
I vote for Alucard-Xz to return. Just watch the 3rd replay of it l, and watch the white aura of the third swing. It isn't pointed straight at muffin at all: in fact, it is more like a 25 degree angle with respect to their positions.
Technically, you cant tell if someone is using AT even if they hit them dead on. Vids need to be recorded by the players in order to verify.
Hasn't even been a week and people are already being thrown out with guilty until proven innocent style accusations. I mean, c'mon. Aiming a FF combo isn't that hard, and that's coming from a gamepad player.
C'm'on this is definitely not auto aim.
It is quite obvious, he was out of boost and would probably have been hit by his opponent if he had stand still without being able to cancel.
So he aimed with the combo, a guardian who was out of shield hoping to be able to do the more damages, and maybe to finish him.
The fault comes from his opponent who suddenly stopped to play assuming auto aim, without even finishing the duel. If he stops to play, the responsability is on him, you shouldn't even make the match again, because alucard won.
It should resume, with Alucard 1-0.
As val said, muffin challenged incorrectly, and lost the first game because of that.
Hopefully darkcub agrees with people here
Alucard is disqualified so stop trying to help him, it's too late
Wow....this tournament really is garbage. Cheating and false AT claims are allowed, but only if they are from Oracion members.
You guys are like a pathetic....go jump in front of a train when you get the chance. I am not coming back here to hear your lame comebacks.
If you arent an oracion member you might as well quit, with these self centered losers are just trying to promote their self image.
@Octaslash if you just want to attract attention try to become famous in real life and stop fooling around
+ Don't call anyone pathetic if you're using an alt to insult us in the forums.
I'm gonna ignore this kid and explain this well.
Alucard is banned because of the HIGH PROBABILITY OF AT. We can't know it for sure, but since we wanna make this fair and that combo looked so suspicious since the angle was big and the accuracy was perfect. We would have done the same if Illu or any player that makes gameplays without AT would have thrown that combo. That's why I always suggest people to record their own games for showing them if something like this happens and they weren't ATing. I'm sorry for Alucard and I repeat that we can't be sure about this "AT", but since the probablity was very high the judges decided to ban him.
While at a first glance it looked like AT to me, you can see by pausing/watching the slowmo that his hits are not dead centered, which is really all one needs to see that it's not AT.
I hate AT and I tend to dislike all those that make use of it, but in this case I am on Alucard's side (who I don't even know), since it's pretty clear he didn't AT. Now you guys can go ahead, disqualify him, and be pathetic like you have been for a few months; or wake up, stop acting like LD is your kingdom and for once try to be fair, without always making rules ad hoc. Especially you Pony. I know Bleyu is hopeless, but you know better than this.
A rematch should be no problem.
"All players are equal, but some players are more equal than others"
Well, Illu and Fatcub think that he used AT too, we woudlnt disqualify someone before thinking it well.
Just to clearify.
I said it certainly looks like AT, but it could easily be aim.
See that ^ thats really all I wanted to hear. The judges have every right to be suspect of moves like the one above, I get it. I just didnt like how Bleyken is acting like I'm an obvious cheater when you guys have no sure way to tell. I truely believe there is enough evidence to support I didnt use AT, but thats my opinion, I will be recording in the future, but this was a bummer. I can live with them admitting they arent 100%. Especially since I didnt cheat.. And the background song I mean.. Really dude? how immature, arrogant, and rude can you possibly be?
this is the epitome of the spiral knights hierarchy know as "lockdown"
just because one group of players, or guild, think they're better than others, gives them justification to do sh*tty things and get away with it
''giving advice while being one of the tournament recorders (and leader) and his guildmate just isnt fair.''
I repeat what you said: Your argument is based off of assumptions, and therefore is not valid. Jleung is also from Oracion and Contri isn't the tournament's leader.
Well, I also have received stupid advices about something which was obvious in many 1v1s and I didn't receive any complain. It's not illu's fault if he receives any advice without asking for it. Even I could say that the advice bothered him since it was so obvious and he didn't need it.
How can receiving an advice be cheating? What do you want? If we receive any stupid advice without asking for it we won't stop the 1v1 to start it again. Even if we do it we'd already have read the ''advice''.