Spiral Knights - Accessories need fixing now.

Accessories need fixing now.

49 replies [Last post]

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 02:16

Kirnan

This is more of a rant, however, I will be posting this in my balance thread as well.

Everyone has taken a stance on accessories, either they endorse the rarity of them and the current implementation, or they are against the system and find it unfair.

I am against it, though I understand the arguments of a few people who are for the overpriced monstrosities. So let's sum up the advantages/disadvantages.

Pros:
They look neat, for the most part.
They make a player stand out.
They create variety in the system for equipment sets.

Cons:
Being so overpriced, they ensure only 1% of players will ever have more than 1.
As only 1% of players will have them, the variety added is rather nil, and thus we still see only a few people ever wearing them.
The system is random, so you could potentially spend hundreds of dollars just to get what you really want.
They are permanent, meaning the accessory you use gets one use, so eve the rich players will have issues ever getting sets they want.
They enforce an unfair divide between wealthy people and poor people in a setting that is supposed to lessen that divide from what real life shows us.
This game already has a heavy-ended CE sink in crafting and just playing the game.

So why really put in items like this at all? It seems like OOO is starting to cave to corporate greed, and that is rather upsetting for such a unique company to be going down that road. What makes the least sense is that the current system will gain them less money overall, as the majority of the population will be ignoring accessories for their lack of decent price or their one-shot use.

Personally, I can easily see accessories being ok if you could take them off of equipment and just have them bound to your character. They don't flood the market and allow you to build a little stock of them to outfit your equipment. That makes the steep price bearable, as the items are permanent. Fix this, and I would say lots more people would be willing to sink the CE on the keys. As it stands now, instead of half the population running around and looking as they should, we will see a few rarities, and this game needs more diversity in looks.....*sadface* I just want to see this game succeed, and it is headed to a path of eventual destruction, and I don't want to see it as this game that only a few thousand people end up playing. Laverna is right, too, OOO will eventually update more with these gambling-style elitist content patches.

______________________________

My Suggestions Compilation Thread: http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/14651
My Balance Compilation Thread: http://forums.spiralknights.com/en/node/27538

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 02:31

Madadder

i'll only admit to the

i'll only admit to the removing= deleting them is a bad idea

my counter proposal= run one clockworks run per day on mist energy converting all CR into CE when u have 700CE wait for 50 ME and buy a key. its not hard u bum...

its also not the end of the world you work for your armor from assuming you got your armor at 3* it costs 1200CE to get it to 5* (plus other expenses). whats so different about this other than the aesthetics which we all know rose regalia trumps all others

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 02:45

Kirnan

Rose Regalia sucks

Seriously, it's not even that aesthetically pleasing. Furthermore, all of my money goes to crafting better armor, so that I have more diversity to play this game.

Aside from that, again, it is not so much the money required as the fact that it is a random system. I could just as easily see the accessories instead sold in an item shop for varying amounts of CE. I would definitely play 1500 CE for an aura, or even 2000CE for a prismatic accessory, again, given that they are able to be placed on different pieces of armor later on.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 03:03

Madadder

and what happens when you

and what happens when you have ALL sets of armor? what then? ragecraft for UVs?

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 03:48

Kirnan

Well yeah

I mean think about it, little accessory or attempt to make a triple UV that gives you good bonuses? Seriously, the choice is rather clear there. If I had a Leviathan with the UV's of CTR Very High, ASI: Very High and DB: Fiends Very High, I would be showing that off so much more than some set of sunglasses on one helm that I only wear into some strata.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 05:31

Flash-Bang

When you have ALL sets of

When you have ALL sets of armor?

lol I can't even imagine playing long enough to get ALL sets of armor. Been 3 months now for me and I'm just working on my SECOND set.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 05:44

Juances

this is what i did back when i just started playing the game

1. buy a bomb recipe
2. ragecraft till good UV appears
3. ????
4. PROFIT!!!

blast bomb CTR high, i miss you

I agree these thing should be able to be rmoved for free but...
Even if reward is random this can be neglected given the fact you can trade with other players for the one you want.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 06:37

Volebamus

Kirnan, you have to accept

Kirnan, you have to accept that these items are not for you. These are mostly for people who have tons of CE to spend, already have all of the equipment they have/need/want aside from the rarest of UV combinations, and/or just care more about costumes rather than anything else.

Unless you can see yourself as a person who would shell out tens thousands of CE for costumes already, you really shouldn't even bother thinking about accessories.

Accept that the lockboxes are not for you, and just sell them off in the Auction House for tens of thousands of crowns.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 06:39

Kirnan

As it stands

This game takes a lot of time, unless you buy oodles of CE, in which case it is drastically shortened. I can not see anyone having everything ever, unless they spent 100's on this game. Accessories should at least be more accessible. And allowing them to be removed and not destroyed would be a good first step.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 07:03

Volebamus

You're quite wrong about this

You're quite wrong about this game taking a lot of time to get CE, as there are many ways to make tens of thousands of CE without having to spend actual money. Some of it by luck by crafting very sought-out UVs, and others by buying and selling the right items at the right time.

There is no reason that accessories have to be more accessible just because of customization, as even now most players who have CE budgets wouldn't craft even 5* just to have the costume they would like, never mind the ones that actually do cost a lot like the Regalia items. I would though personally like to see them be non-destroyable when removed yet still bound to the player so it can't be traded off, but I bet the only reason they didn't do that was because of coding issues.

Tell me this: do you even see yourself spending 5kce for the costume you like, which has no function to you otherwise? If not, then you're far off from even thinking about accessories.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 07:26

#10

Kirnan

Doubtful

Why spend 5k CE for a costume when I can spend 1100k CE for a 5-star item that could be used as a costume?

Also, this game does not guarantee you crafting amazing items to sell, and I never said it takes lots of time to get CE when you can buy more for real money.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 07:31

#11

Volebamus

Again, you are showing you

Again, you are showing you really aren't familiar with costumes at all. Look up Regalia prices.

You are just unwilling to accept you are not the target market for these items.

Additionally, I said you DON'T need to spend real money to get tons of CE.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 07:56

#12

Kirnan

But that is the point.

I dislike Regalia items, as they lack any real unique flair, and have no real good qualities.

And furthermore, if you do not spend real money, it does take time to amass CE.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 07:59

#13

Hova

Do any of you people who are

Do any of you people who are defending the prices realized yet that if they came out with a low price in the first place you wouldn't be saying "Make it more expensive"? Exactly, that's what I thought, you wouldn't be. You'd probably be saying "This is a great feature that permits easy customization of the Knight in an easy way".

Isn't that funny? Hahaha.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:07

#14

Redmania

Sigh @ Entitlement Generation

Once again, I will mention that the entitlement generation will whine and moan at all things that will require some patience and work.
And Volebamus is 100% correct. I am on a FREE ACCOUNT and I have a full vog set, three 5* shields, a 5* gun, four 5* swords and two 5* trinkets.
It took me approximately 3-4 weeks to get a full vog set, 5* weapon and 5* shield.

How did I do it?
Patience and hard work, not moaning and groaning. (If I were to moan and groan at anything, it would be my supreme bad luck at rolling UVs! =D)

Games like WoW have gone downhill because the developers listened to much to the kids in the entitlement generation, most of them pulling the "I am the customer, therefore I am always right" crap...

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:25

#15

Hova

@RedmaniaIt's funny because

@Redmania
It's funny because you really don't know anything, now do you? I'm part of your so called "Entitlement Generation" and yet I'm still a free player and plan to never spend a dime on this. I work hard for what I want, you have no idea what you're talking about, don't speak about a whole generation unless you know all about that generation. Sure, some of this "Entitlement Generation" may feel entitled but that gives you absolutely no right to proclaim the whole generation is a bunch of selfish lazy children.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:23

#16

Stelli

im fine with the price, the

im fine with the price, the more expensive the better.

but u have seem to be underestimating the SK community ;), there are alot more rich players than you think.

I think OOO is not stupid enough to screw up such simple player statistics marketing.

They know there are enough players out there who could spend this sort of CE/cash, thats why they implement it at this price.

"They enforce an unfair divide between wealthy people and poor people in a setting that is supposed to lessen that divide from what real life shows us."

Who told you that online games are supposed to lesson the divide from what real life shows us? If you are rich in real life, you deserve to be rich in a game, this divide will always exist everywhere (maybe except sports, if you suck, you suck).

I am supporting this divide, where people who have worked hard, or have contributed more are entitled to more.

On the other hand, this is a great opportunity to nabs to get rich.

There is a chance that lock boxes will drop at the end of every level, of course higher tiers have higher chances.

They are sold approximately from 20k ~ 30k Crowns each.

Silver keys that opens these boxes for accessories cost 750 ce (750 CE is roughly 44k Crowns).

Meaning if you get 2 boxes, you can sell them for 40k crowns or more. and the 3rd box that you obtain, you will be able to afford a Silver key to open it.

and if you decide not to open them, and sell them all for crowns, you can net a profit just farming for boxes.

I have gotten 3 Lockboxes from Tier 3, and 2 from Tier 2 in a day and I'm considered unlucky.

If you don't even bother going through depths and just complain, there's nothing that could help you.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:24

#17

Redmania

@Hova

If you work hard for what you want, then you aren't part of the entitlement generation, are you...
It's just a term to describe the large amount of mostly younger players that demand to have things served to them on a silver plate without working for it...

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:27

#18

Volebamus

Kirnan, Regalia are pretty

Kirnan, Regalia are pretty much unique themselves, especially as the hats are so different from other things you could wear as costumes. And your complaint about them having "no real good qualities" is the SAME EXACT argument you could make about accessories, as in they do nothing aside from looks. Second, you are plain wrong about amassing CE if you're experienced at this game. I myself have developed methods to earn 2kce profit every week with minimal effort without spending any real $, and that's ignoring the crowns and materials I pick up from my runs. You are basically showing how unfamiliar you are in the markets, and accessories are yet another market you shouldn't worry yourself over.

Hova, it's called accepting the reality of the situation. I'd actually use it myself if they were cheap, but I *gasp* decide not to at these prices. Stop whining. You might as well complain that costuming up as a Vog Cub without intending to use its stat bonuses is super expensive, and people will not agree with that point either. Can you not accept this has no actual gameplay function, therefore meant for high-rollers who actually have thousands of CE to drop without issue?

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:27

#19

Hova

@Redmania Well I know a lot

@Redmania
Well I know a lot of people who are as young as I am and yet don't spend money on this game/games and work hard like I do. Just because some younger people don't know how to work doesn't mean they all don't, so there is absolutely no right to say as a whole of our generation feels like their entitled.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:29

#20

Malhaku

"Accessories should at least

"Accessories should at least be more accessible."

Accessories are completely frivolous items that have no effect on gameplay mechanics. If they made someone into a superman compared to others, I would agree as to their accessibility. As they are is doesn't matter.

Everyone yelling and screaming about these accessories just feels like more of the same "I'm entitled to this!!" whining that litters forums of any game. I would love to see some of the people that go on and on about what they "deserve" and how the game "should" be to take that attitude to other aspects of life... Stand up on an airplane and start yelling "It's not fair that the people in first class get better seats and meals because they paid more. I deserve the same treatment!!"

I agree, the accessories are completely slanted toward pay players, but as pay players help sustain the game (first through giving OOO income and second by making the CE base that everyone else buys from) I have no problem with them having easier access to these types of content.

@Hova : If my car cost less than I paid for it, I definitely wouldn't complain. That being said, I bought the car for a reasonable price in my evaluation. Just because someone would gladly purchase something at a lower price doesn't make them a hypocrite for defending the price as it is...

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 08:38

#21

Redmania

@ Hova

Apparently, you need to re-read what I wrote.

"It's just a TERM to describe the large amount of MOSTLY younger players that demand to have things served to them on a silver plate without working for it..."

If that description does not describe you, you are NOT part of the entitlement generation... I don't see what is so hard to comprehend.
If you, want I can name it "entitled youngters?" Perhaps you can provide me with a better term.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 09:14

#22

Cadeau

market correction

There's no need to complain. Just take a look at the auction house where the price of lockboxes are plummeting. Players are voting with their wallets which is the best way to get OOO to make changes.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 09:20

#23

Mejezfeld

So..

I kinda am already VERY familiar with the feeling of running around people who have costumes and all sorts of fancy cosmetic pay-only items and mounts and stuff that I will never be able to get unless I paid in real dough.

For me, that's not a problem...

Though, even in other F2P MMORPGs I played the cosmetic items didn't have the backwards logic that Accessories here have- you could transfer and swap and trade them fairly easily with other players even AFTER you were done with ACTUALLY USING them... they didn't permanently graft to a piece of equipment and get destroyed and stuff when you decided you were tired with. THAT'S the problem.

Imagine if accessories and jewellery worked that way in real life. Just imagine, and tell me you will not RAAAAAAAAGE.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 09:38

#24

Hova

@Redmania Doesn't describe

@Redmania
Doesn't describe me? You were describing the younger generations from what I read, which I am apart of, so as far as I'm concerned you were describing the entire younger generations as a whole.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 09:44

#25

Skeena

I agree you should be able to

I agree you should be able to remove them without losing it and also be able to unbind.

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 09:46

#26

Skeena

I agree you should be able to

oopsy double post

Fri, 10/07/2011 - 13:38

#27

Mohandar

Agreed. Accessories should

Agreed. Accessories should be a little rarer, bind to player, but be transferable between pieces of equipment owned by that player. Have the Accessories Merchant sell basic accessories (for tokens, cr, ce, lockboxes, whatever), the way certain Bombheads are available from Sullivan.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 12:04

#28

Kirnan

You all are illiterate

Again, I mentioned that either prices should drop for keys or the accessories should be changed to be removable without destruction. This has nothing to do with entitlement, it has everything to do with creating a divide between paying players and wealthy paying players. I know a few of you feel that there should be a divide just as much as in real life, and I feel truly sorry that greed is such a large motivation in life for you. For me, diversity is what matters, and that is what I saw in accessories. An attempt at diversity. As it stands now, there will be little use of them by the populace, and much use of them by a small percentage of players.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 12:18

#29

Engie

OH NO GUYS OH NO SOMEONE

OH NO GUYS
OH NO
SOMEONE DOESN'T LIKE COSTUME ITEMS
OH NO
DELETE THEM QUICK

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 12:40

#30

Redmania

@Hova and @subject =D

Sigh... I didn't say you in particular were part of the entitlement generation. You just decided to associate yourself with the term. You are free to do whatever you want... I don't care... I'm just going to stop responding to you after this because it is quite apparent you are either not sufficiently fluent in English to understand what I am saying or simply not bothering to read all the words in my posts before making a comment.

Back on topic. Although I am generally fine with the way the accessory update has been handled, I do agree that destruction of accessories upon removal is a little harsh. However, buying it once and allowing you to attach it whatever you wanted would cause the accessory market to crash. Perhaps, OOO can implement an energy fee for the removal of accessories.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 15:45

#31

Kaphraxus

Kirnan I do agree with the

Kirnan I do agree with the whole accessory being destroyed when removed thing but you have to understand that these items were implemented because so many people have reached 5* and have nothing much else to do except grind UV's.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 19:16

#32

Kirnan

Maybe so,

but honestly, Kaph, it's a bit annoying that the system itself supports gambling and massive energy purchase. I dislike when companies make moves based on greed and not innovation, which itself at least fosters monetary gain.

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 20:31

#33

Xylka-Mkii

Ok i support the

Ok i support the "dont-destroy-after-removal" group and have to say this...

This patch was made for 5* players, not for new begginners who are out to get stronger and not prettier. If its not for you, dont complain. Also you want diversity...yet want all players to be allowed equality to everything they want...
Look; I'm fine with people voicing thier opinion. But that doesn't mean you get what you want. Also i disagree. It does NOT support gambling. It supports the idea of supporting those who make the game for you or a nice little thing to do when you're bored (i.e end-gamers). If you don't like it DONT USE IT. No one will really care what you decide, there are many other people who act their choice instead of saying it.

I love SK and think the devs know what they are doing.

To conclude, and counter you again. This has been once again, a successful update. I dare you to go on trade chat, go look in the AH and go look at the Bazaar forums. These accessories are working fine as is. If its not broken, don't even make an attempt to fix it.

Going on about the "entitlement people":

If you are going to call out and say that you think you deserve as much as those with money, Which ill remind you it is THEY who actually generate and give the "entitlement people" and the other people CE, then we are allowed to call you out of your entitlement.

If you want this stuff free, then everyone reaches endgame, no more $ for OOO, thus everyone quits and the game dies forever.

My Opinion:

I am a F2P player. I wasted my Starter pack CE fast while still in Proto and as I continued on as F2P for the rest of the game, I LEARNED. I learned how the CE system works, why it works that way, and made a plan to get to 5*. I am currently in full Skolver with an FoV, CoA, Polaris Wild hunting blade, BTB, Blitz needle and Leviathan.
All of those were obtained though working and using the CR from runs on mist to make CE.

I now learned how to get 30kCR per day in pure profit. If i was still T2 and had my knowledge from now, Id still make 20kCR profit. Accessory system works and is fun to use. I am really hoping to get a Wolver Tail (look at wiki, you can get them.) through trade or maybe random box. I recently purchased a Cool Canteen for 40kcr. I support the game and the system, if you don't like it, then dont use it. No one said you have to.

This merely encourages players to either support OOO by buying 2$ of CE to have a taste of a feature, or by working hard for what they want and eventually getting it, and feeling that they accomplished a feat.

Now to truly end this:

Use it or lose it.
Thats all i can say.
Hate it? ok were fine with it.
Try it? kewl maybe you'll...
Like it? Great! now you have a goal to work towards.

IMO These threads are no more than old CE threads with a disguise.

As we all say: 'Blame Boswick Lol'

~Xylka

P.S I think the Canteens are pretty cool!^-^

Sat, 10/08/2011 - 21:41

#34

Madadder

I dislike when companies make

I dislike when companies make moves based on greed and not innovation

http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/innovation
http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/the-future-of-mmos

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:02

#35

Michaelb

Wait, what happens to the

Wait, what happens to the accessories on n item when you alchemize it to a higher version?

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:17

#36

Skolleks

The most easy and complete solution

The most easy and complete solution, is down the price of the keys. accessories's price its cost almost like a 5* equip. The accesories are accesories because of that it should have a lower price if I compare the price with equip.
Well this is my opinion, my goal is make the accessories for all and a unique spiral knight.

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:17

#37

Skolleks

The most easy and complete solution

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:17

#38

Skolleks

The most easy and complete solution

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:19

#39

Skolleks

Steam browser error sry for the copies

buuuurp

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:22

#40

Michaelb

can someone please tell me if

can someone please tell me if the accessory stays when you craft an item from the equipment that it is on?

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:38

#41

Volebamus

KirnanAgain, I mentioned

Kirnan
Again, I mentioned that either prices should drop for keys or the accessories should be changed to be
removable without destruction.

Yep, now you have me on board. Completely agree with this.

In all honesty, I don't see why anyone would like for them to be destroyed, though I bet it's a coding issue for OOO. Like what Mohandar said: "bind to player, but be transferable between pieces of equipment owned by that player."

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 15:47

#42

Hova

@Redmania Whatever floats

@Redmania
Whatever floats your boat.

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 16:12

#43

Coneykrab

My Problems With Acessories

Sorry to say it, but there are not really any accessories that interest me. Some are just awful (Barrel Belly, really? Is it supposed to be a gag or something?) or lack the pizzazz that they were meant to give. I'd settle for a Love Puppy Aura, but those don't exist. :(
*Maybe* a backsword or something, but I'm sure those are in ridiculous demand. Can we players suggest or draw up some items we'd like to see, maybe in contest form if it suits the devs? Nothing super-huge, but I'd just like to see something that I'd like to equip.

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 16:38

#44

Richy

You can buy accessories for

You can buy accessories for 7k crowns at the AH, just saying.

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 16:52

#45

Flamaxe

Oh....

I thought you meant fix them... my Bomb belt appears as a canteen...

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 17:05

#46

Kriptoid

O_O

one question if you per se put a accessory on a wolver cap and upgrade it will it stay on?

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 17:26

#47

Flamaxe

@Kriptoid

It's a bit like a UV. Yea it carry's over.

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 17:38

#48

Juances

Some upgrades change the look

Some upgrades change the look of the armor/helmet completely, making some accesories bad.

Mon, 10/10/2011 - 18:23

#49

Neodasus

uh, dude

accessories fund development

Quit complaining.

When I played Maplestory I spent like 30 bucks every two months minimum. Spiral Knights players have it easy because accs can be sold in the auction house.

Search

Accessories need fixing now.