Spiral Knights - Music Discussion Thread. May the phrygian be with you. (This thread is scheduled to die when it leaves the front page.)

Music Discussion Thread. May the phrygian be with you. (This thread is scheduled to die when it leaves the front page.)

67 replies [Last post]

Fri, 08/24/2012 - 19:45

Jiker

If you are not educated in the wonderful world of music, you may have a hard time understanding this post. Beware.
EDIT: But you DO NOT need to have knowledge of music to post your thoughts!!

Being a musician, I find that I listen to not only the music as a whole, but as separate "instruments," and I isolate each part in my head before I can get the true sound of the music. It also allows me to appreciate classical and jazz, but that's not the point. You wonderful knights are here to share your thoughts on the music of the great Harry Mack for Spiral Knights. I'll start.

1. Gloaming Wildwoods.
For the first few times I played through the Wildwoods, it made me imagine a kind of eerie, dark, mystical forest. The beautiful oboe, the deep bassoon, and strings made the piece very enjoyable.
Then I heard the drumkit.
At first I wasn't fond of it. Then I realized it added a sort of presence to the feeling, as if there was something much more threatening behind the trees. Totally different than my first impression. Also, there was this great major chord that followed a few staccato notes from the oboe, and if anyone with perfect pitch, or The Listener himself, can tell me if it is an A major chord or not. I doubt it is. But it might be. Oh well.

2. Shock.
My fav. Know why? I do. It is the reason why most people say that they like modern, auto-tuned, lacking-musical-talent-of-any-sort "music." It has a great beat, and it's catchy. You can hum it. There's a nice bass line. Piano riffs. It effectively portrays the level by using techno-sounding instruments.
I believe the bass is: E, F, E E. E, F, G G. F G. F F F. F G E. repeat.

3. Poison
Love it. 'Cause it's JAZZY. It could seriously be the head of a jazz piece. Great elec. cello thingy for the bass. Guitar melody. Echo-y sound for the call-and-response effect. Nice drums.

4. Freeze
Depressing. Lonely. Melancholy. Fits just right for the level. Makes you think of a frozen wasteland. Xylophone is a good choice. Love to hear it when a cold breeze comes through the window.

5. Munitions
Hard to hum. No distinct melody. Yet it defines a factory at full production rate with loose electric cords everywhere. Kinda chaotic.

6. Sky Islands Day Action.
Love the chip-tune. It's a happy song. Chord progressions resolve from a dominant 7 down a fifth to a major. Nice. Cool rhythm drum thing. Me like much much.

More to come later. Or it can be continued by readers.

Fri, 08/24/2012 - 19:54

Xylka-Mkii

As a fellow musician, I

As a fellow musician, I support this thread.

Honestly I love the Main theme and Ready Room probably most of all. The calmness of it is one of the big ones, but the different instruments being used and the gradual cresendo is really nice to hear. Also there's something about the Ready Room that always makes me feel tired, and even a little depressed. Probably just the nice slow strings for the melody and the techno thing (idk what its called) coming in the background later in the piece. Really hope we get a remastered version of it in the next album release :)

Fri, 08/24/2012 - 19:56

Xylka-Mkii

As a fellow musician, I

dislike double posting, and my ISP.

Sat, 08/25/2012 - 14:35

Jiker

Bump dat sucka.

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 08:49

Listener

Game Master

Sir Mixolydian likes big clefs

Thanks Jiker!

1. I have to agree with the drumkit that it doesn't quite fit the song perfectly. However without it, it was so barren and empty it gave the wrong impression of what was going on - like a very lonely trip through woods instead of a hunt-or-be-hunted adventure. It does serve its purpose of adding threat, but in an earlier version I kept the synth out of it and tried just timpani. Made for a great song, but something that didn't fit for Spiral Knights. The chord you are mentioning is D major.

2. Shocking Synthesizers went through the most revisions than any other spiral tune. I was almost ready to throw it away and try a completely new song until I shifted things and made the whole thing a lot lower, and thus more threatening. That was really Nick's issue with it, everything I kept sending was so sparky and upbeat, but it didn't match the visuals or the mood of danger and threat. Anyway, you have the bass mostly correct, the last three notes are E-F-D instead.

Xylka, what makes you feel depressed about the Ready Room? I was hoping to go for the anxiety of about to go on stage in front of a million people, or in spiral knights terms, about to pop down into a dangerous mission you're not sure you'll ever come back from. But feeling tired and depressed? Interesting! In a remix what would you prefer to hear, maybe something faster, higher?

Thanks guys!

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 09:04

Xylka-Mkii

The Listener speaks to us! Huzzah!

@Listener
I think its probably just me not used to anything really too slow paced in the game. Kinda as if like you're a veteran knight from the spiral order, trekking out of the clockworks after a long battle with your comrades. Or like you said
"about to pop down into a dangerous mission you're not sure you'll ever come back from. "
Though it didn't give the feeling of rising tension or anything

Idk, its probably just me. I understand what you were going for now, and honestly I like it how it is :) It keeps a somewhat unique feel from all the other tracks, and its nice to have variety between the music while still retaining that Spiral Knights style.

Also I would love it if you could tell us what key some of the tracks are in. I really want to try playing the main theme on the piano (title screen and "in battle" version :) )

Either way, keep up with the awesome music :D

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 09:50

Raspberry

Soulful beauty

Dear Listener,

I just got back from a year long hiatus two weeks ago and was pleasantly surprised to log into game to a Ready Room with such beautiful music. It's like a hybrid of Aaron Copeland, Samuel Barber mixed with a little bit of Moby. I could listen to that piece all day if my knight didn't fall asleep and disconnect.

Often times I just come in game to relax and listen to your music. I hope the new guild hall update has a Juke Box where we can listen to your music while we craft and have have meetings.

Speaking of Juke Boxes, in Aphrodite's SK Crest Competition, I transformed our Obsidian Crest of Mack into a wearable, high fidelity sound system that plays your game music. There's even a soulful, imaginary lichen that now follows us around named Harry.

Thank you for your awesome music and taking the time to converse with your fans,
Raspberry

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 11:48

Listener

Game Master

>_>

Xylka: You know, forget everything I said. I was talking about the Mission Lobby music this whole time, not the Ready Room music. Yes, that's very slow and has nothing to do with anxiety. Whew! You must have thought I was crazy, and you'd be right.

If you have a specific request I can take a look, but one thing to try is to youtube A 440 or play an A on piano. From there, just fiddle around until you find a note that seems to be the core of the song and that's likely it.

I would love to hear a piano version of any of these songs. I've tried it myself and gave up after a few minutes; it just doesn't seem to work. Closest I came was the RJP music.

Raspberry: I once got a letter from someone in Brazil saying they play the intro music to put their two year old to sleep. I'm very happy to know the RR music has a similar affect for your knight!

Awesome crest! I wish I could snag that jelly and use it for my forum avatar, he's great! Thank you so much for making it, and for your kind words.

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 12:15

Xylka-Mkii

@Listener Oh lol, that makes

@Listener
Oh lol, that makes sense then. And Since I got to go to piano practice soon, I might as well try playing the main theme!

Also, Raspberry, that is one awesome looking pic. :)

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 17:26

Raspberry

Soul Jelly Harry

@ Listener,

I put Soul Jelly Harry on the Wiki for easy access in case you can get one of the admin to do a special forum avatar for you since you are a Ringer and the music genius of OOO. Ask Eurydice.

Soul Jelly Harry on black background (to easily isolate and place on a background of your choosing)
Arcade Harry resonating harmony with the crystals in the arcade.

PS:
I hope you become as popular a composer as Nobuo Uematsu from the Final Fantasy series so we can go see your orchestrated concerts someday!

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 03:56

#10

Takendown

Finally! A Music Discussion Thread! (We Need More Of These)

Seriously, it's nice to see one of these once in a while.

As you may know, I'm a massive fan of Spiral Knight's Music and being a fellow musician myself I can relate to some of the things you have pointed out in your post, Jiker. (I've also released a Spiral Knights album, Spiral Knights: Remixed! a couple of days ago which features a song I recomposed that you mentioned above. Check it out when you can.)

Gloaming Wildwoods: When I first heard this piece, I weren't really into it just like you. It's pieces like these that really grow on you when you replay the Gloaming Wildwoods levels. Listener/Harry Mack really knows what instruments to use and how to use them to set the desired mood. It isn't a coincidence that I pictured a dark, eerie forest also.

Shock: Also one of my favs, though I'll possibly find it hard if I were ever to recreate this piece. You'll notice that the track is full electric-type instruments. It's also very nostalgic for me as this is one of the very first themes I heard upon crashing here in Cradle. Oh, the memories.

Poison: This, I'm not very fond of. Reasons be that the status effect this piece is attached to is simply terrible. I always find myself Poisoned for whatever reason. But the track itself is good. Just one of few tracks I don't take much interest in.

Freeze: And here's another one. It just doesn't fit my needs, though Listener/Mr. Mack has chosen the right instruments to use to distribute the feeling of a very chilly yet soothing atmosphere. Xylaphone works perfectly, while the strings accompany it. This piece is no doubt beautiful and peaceful, but it's another one I'm not fond of. I'm more upbeat. Kind of...

Munitions: Ah, I disagree with it being very hard to hum. With me, I usually hum the strings in the back. It's the most catchy part for me. Either that or the electric melody. Try it!

Sky Islands Day Action: Haha! One of my most favs! This be the track I was referring to earlier in this post about it being on my Album. I've recomposed this from scratch, and boy did I have fun doing so. It seems that Listener/Harry Mack has gone with a more... Video game type feeling with this piece, using instruments (Saw Lead etc) similar to those that you'd find in older type games. I must say, I went down a similar route when recomposing this track.

One other track you should mention is the Beast Theme (the theme you hear in Wolver Dens). This piece is truely amazing as it sits as the musical outcast to all others. That isn't to say that's bad, but it's very different. The drums. The Pan Flutes. All work together in alliance to achieve a "wild" type feeling. Love that track!

I could go on and on, but I think I've exceeded the limits of 'normal post length'; this is getting a bit lengthy.

Ooh,

@Raspberry: Based off what Harry has already composed for us, I reckon he can give Nobuo Uematsu a run for his money!

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 19:05

#11

Xylka-Mkii

Also, Listener, If you could

Also, Listener, If you could provide the key that the main theme is in that would be nice. I tried playing it by ear but failed hehe.

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 19:37

#12

Jiker

You can add on to my list Takendown, those were just starters! Don't Stop the music!
@Listener Well for the chord I wasn't that far off, only a fifth down, which musically isn't that far off right? D maj. DOES have an A in it anyway. ;)

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 20:55

#13

Dispensor-Problems

May the 6(real) modes assist you while you slay the vile Locrian

Blast Network:

I really enjoy the D central tonic in this song (because i love D in general)....I think this one's in D dorian....but idk
I also really enjoy the chromatic-scale-thingy during the song...amazes me how well the mighty listener used the tritone (G#)...I think it goes like:
D F G G# A---A G# G F D
Now that i look at it closer...i realize its the first 5 notes of the D blues scale. Mr. Mack...are you a blues fan?

Blast Network (time running out/SD version):

It still keeps the central tonic, except the whole song is much more rushed....
I also really like the little A phrygian part in the middle of the song.

I suck at chords.....

Sun, 08/26/2012 - 21:35

#14

Raspberry

Harry v. Nubuo

@ Takendown,

Harry has more hybrid range of styles than Nubuo, but Nubuo has more exposure as a Square Enix composer so he gets to do those grand concerts. As much as I adore Nubuo's classical game compositions, I love Harry's eclectic mix of classical, steam punk genre, jazz and contemporary styles more. He's pure genius. He's like having Bach, Vivaldi, Mozart, Aaron Copeland, Samuel Barber, Igor Stravinsky, Thelonious Monk, and Moby all rolled-up into one awesome composer. I would really like to see Harry in concert some day.

I might try a vocaloid of RJP with a tiny chorus of jelly minions conducted by Gelatinous Monk with Soul Jelly Harry in lead vocals.

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 03:57

#15

Takendown

@Raspberry - Took the words right out of my mouth! Both Nubuo and Harry Mack are extremely great composers, and I'd be happy if I harness just half of the compositional talent both Nubuo and Harry Mack have.

Hell, I'd like to see them both in a concert. I have yet to visit a Final Fantasy/Nubuo Uematsu concert anyway.

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 18:15

#16

Jiker

Bump'd

Tue, 08/28/2012 - 19:19

#17

Virtuewis

I Don't Particularly Like Modes And Liquorice

But I do love Harry Mack's work on the SK soundtrack. I'd love to see a live concert of it!

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 01:20

#18

Adolpha

@Jiker

I know exactly what you mean! I'm a musician too and I listen to separate instruments more than I focus on the whole although I'm better at identifying string instruments rather than wind as I'm a string player!

And I usually end up listening to the music on Spiral knights as well as playing the game!
And try to work out the key and notes as well...

Wed, 08/29/2012 - 15:23

#19

Jiker

I be Bumpin' all day.

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 03:59

#20

Takendown

@Adolpher@Jiker - I do the exact same thing as I'm a musician, music composer and producer. Heck, my whole life revolves around music.

Looks like your bumpin' worked, Jiker. Caught my attention. ;)

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 04:40

#21

Thunderbog

hush draggies. i creep in.

I would like to hear a more saddening song such as the Sanctuary theme.

This piece, felt like a kind of tragedy has happened in this place, of someone died. It created an image of himself, maybe not an image, but a lost soul. I think. It settled down and created lights and clouds, that came this magnificent and heavenly Sanctuary. Moreover, it came to warn passerbys.

I want it. ^q^

Also, the new, and maybe the original boss theme, the second version maybe. It is awesome! It's even more fast-paced. I like it, too! ^^

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 16:26

#22

Jiker

Still Bumping. Come on, surely there are more people who want to comment about the music! Right?

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 17:06

#23

Missleovich

It's really sad that battle_2

It's a real shame battle_2 isn't used more often, since it's a much nicer piece than the default battle_1 that plays at almost every encounter. In my opinion at least.

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 17:25

#24

Virtuewis

D'awww /gigglesnort

No one got the nerdy little mnemonic device I put in the subject of my last comment?

"I don't particularly like modes and liquorice" is the order of the musical modes of the major scale. ^^

(Ionian, Dorian, Phrygian, Lydian, Mixolydian, Aeolian, Locrian) For anyone in school for music, this might help!

Back on topic: The soundtrack to this game has all of my favorite components! It is a perfect blend of old and new styles and instruments. I can't wait to see what he does next!

Thu, 08/30/2012 - 19:46

#25

Jiker

That... is an extremely useful mnemonic.

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 17:27

#26

Jiker

Why is no one interested in this thread? (*cough* Bump *cough*)

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 18:36

#27

Dispensor-Problems

@Vituewis I kinda remember

@Vituewis

I kinda remember the modes in this way. Aeolian starts with an "A", and the A aeolian scale is all natural. Same with Dorian and "D". Phrygian kinda sounds....phreakish (when it descends all the way).

The rest i kinda...idk actually.

Fri, 08/31/2012 - 19:52

#28

Virtuewis

@ Dispensor-Problems

I basically think of them in terms of the Major/minor system. Basically all they are, are forms of the Major (or minor) scale with displaced 1/2-step relationships, so that the tendency tones move differently from how they move in the basic Major (Ionian) and minor (Aeolian) scales (modes).
For example: If the mode's 3rd scale degree is minor, I consider it to be a modified minor scale, as in the case with the Dorian, Phrygian, Aeolian, and the less common Locrian modes). If the mode's 3rd degree is Major, I consider it to be a modified Major scale, as in the case with the Ionian, Lydian and Mixolydian modes). All of them are based off the (diatonic) Major scale, that's why the Ionian mode is the same thing as the Major Scale (For example, C Ionian would equate to the C Major scale). The 6th mode of the Major Scale is Aeolian, which in the same thing as the natural minor scale. Ionian to Aeolian is the same as the "relative minor." In the case of C (Ionian), the relative minor is A (Aeolian). That's why the relative minor scale has the same key signature its relative Major, as in the case with C Major and a minor. :D

C Ionian: c, d, e, f, g, a, b, c (Major3rd: c-e) Unmodified Major Scale
d dorian: d, e, f, g, a, b, c, d (minor3rd: d-f) modified minor scale (natural 6, hybrid of natural and melodic minor)
e phrygian: e, f, g, a, b, c, d, e (minor3rd: e-g) modified minor scale (flat 2, similar to natural minor)
F Lydian: f, g, a, b, c, d, e, f (Major3rd: f-a) Modified Major Scale (raised 4 (tritone), similar to Major)
G Mixolydian: g, a, b, c, d, e, f, g (Major3rd g-b) Modified Major Scale (flat 7 (dominant), similar to Major)
a aeolian: a, b, c, d, e, f, g (minor3rd a-c) unmodified natural minor scale
b locrian: b, c, d, e, f, g, a, b (minor3rd b-d) modified minor scale (flat 2, flat 5, similar to natural minor)

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 20:06

#29

Jiker

Thanks for the lecture. Helped me, 'cause I'm sorta new to modes myself (Bump)

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 20:15

#30

Virtuewis

@ Jiker: U know what...

U know what I'd love???? I want to have a little tone generator in-game, so I could hit like F3 and have it play a quick little 5note tune or something! Like a little emote that makes sound! ... one that I picked the notes for the melody, u know what I mean? Instead of it doing: "Follow Me!," it would play my heroic entrance tune or something haha. That would be righteous indeed! If we all had a personalized hero tune that we could hit when we join our guildies' mid-depth to save the day! (hmmm I should suggestions forum that... or not lol).

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 20:45

#31

Luguiru

I may not know what is going on here

But I just want to rock.

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 20:56

#32

Virtuewis

@ Luguiru

That is pretty much all there is to know! ^^ rock on!

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 21:02

#33

Dispensor-Problems

@Virtuewis

That's actually how i remembered them too (comparing to major/minor)....I just used the trick above me to help me memorize the names of the modes.

I had such a hard time in the beginning memorizing the names....
Oh and i consider lydian special for having a tritone, but i consider Locrian mentally insane for having a tritone replace P5.

But i keep forgetting the pentatonic scales (other than minor pentatonic)...

Oh, and as for your tone generator idea....ME GUSTA

But i see several problems with that:
1. I want more than 5 notes.
2. I want to be able to choose the instrument(s) that play.
3. It might be tough to implement.
4. So many people are gonna try to put random notes together....while i spam minor 3rds and perfect 5ths.

Sat, 09/01/2012 - 21:19

#34

Virtuewis

@ Dispensor-Problems

Dude. I love your name! About the music, I know, right??? It would be funny to hear what people would come up with. I said 5 notes, but really it should be like 3 seconds instead, with no note restriction! :D That way it could have rests and tied notes, or just a fat V-I or something haha. Villanous characters could just arpeggiate a diminished chord!

Anyways, afaik a pentatonic is ANY scale with only 5 degrees. But I always use the minor penta "blues" scale too because the guitar is my main instrument. So that's like root - m3 - P4 - P5 - m7. You can add the "bluesy" M3 and the Tritone as passing tones. (for example, a passage going P5-b5(tritone)-P4-m3-tonic or the old: m3 slurred to M3, resolved to tonic)

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 12:27

#35

Dispensor-Problems

I always thought penta-tonic

I always thought penta-tonic were the five degrees you can play with all black notes instead of all white notes (like a diatonic).
I always memorized the Eb minor pentatonic, since its the natural one with all black keys. (i play sax, so i need to know blues).

I also heard you can change a blues scale into a diatonic scale by adding an M2.

If the music generator were ever to be implemented, I can make non-music-theorists jelly when i make beautiful chord progressions, while they try to make music that sounds like me playing piano when i was 4)
Addz me so i shall discuss more music anomalies (IGN is forum name)

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 17:58

#36

Fehzor

Muting the music and playing one direction is quite nice.

The in game music isn't that bad though, I'm just kind of sick of it after playing for.... oh god.

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 22:07

#37

Timbalero

i eez a percussionast and a drummar :)

i always loved the wolver depth music. its very well arranged and it gives you that jungle/hunter sensation and the percussion in it its very thoughtful and very well done. also the sanctuary and ready room music give me the chills sometimes because of how it feels right when you enter the scenarios. imo harry mack is a genius i checked his website once and i would love to record/jam with him at some point!

Sun, 09/02/2012 - 22:27

#38

Luguiru

After a while

The default music gets a little stale at times.

Not that I would consider myself a music critic, especially considering my tastes, when it comes to a futuristic-space-robots theme.

Such as these. And these.

Mon, 09/03/2012 - 11:07

#39

Jiker

If I have to bump this 3 more times, I'm graveyarding it. Unless you really don't want me to...

Tue, 09/04/2012 - 04:31

#40

Jakmad

My favourite piece of music

My favourite piece of music is that played in the first stage of Operation Crimson Hammer. Its just so...medievil. (I know nothing about music, so thats the best I can describe it XD)

Tue, 09/04/2012 - 04:40

#41

Murex

Don't send this to the

Don't send this to the graveyard, Jiker.

Wed, 09/05/2012 - 15:31

#42

Jiker

BUMP MOTHERFUDGER, BUMP

Wed, 09/05/2012 - 16:16

#43

Kraanx

i find it kind of annoying

i find it kind of annoying that every boss encounter has the same music. CMON, HOW CAN A GIANT SLIMY JELLY AND A ROBOTIC DOG DUO HAVE THE SAME MUSIC?

Fri, 09/07/2012 - 21:49

#44

Jiker

Don't die on me now! Keep it going!

Fri, 09/07/2012 - 21:57

#45

Luguiru

I find this fitting.

Fri, 09/07/2012 - 23:20

#46

Vluxor

honestly, i think the music

honestly, i think the music sucks and could be done better. there are many games out there that have better music...
here is one example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPug4ka7On0
this was just the training room for that game.

Fri, 09/07/2012 - 23:28

#47

Luguiru

For a second there

I thought you said Queen sucked.

Well, for peppy-happy-game-y music, I still think Mabinogi classic tracks are pretty good. Most of their newer stuff is just blaring and obnoxious in comparison to the classic comfortable style.

For example, compare these two to this, though I have to admit this is pretty good. None of these are techno-sci-fi-space-robots-in-space related but you can probably tell the difference.

Sat, 09/08/2012 - 10:51

#48

Jiker

Ahem

We're here to discuss spiral knights music, not Mabi-whatever.
Also, if you think you can compose better music, SHOW ME YA MOVES.
And I'm pretty sure the music you're referring to was composed by more than one individual. And it's a different style of game. The two are almost incomparable.

Sat, 09/08/2012 - 12:57

#49

Vluxor

@jiker

yes we can compare. we are comparing how well the music fits with the game and how well the music was developed. so the different style of game doesn't matter. this is why i am showing you music and the game play together.

the last one i showed was their new track for alice in wonderland theme.

does this music sound like it would fit for sports for this game?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4H40CaAz7d0&feature=relmfu

does this music fit for battle mode? or chaser?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=er44YiDQfRA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJbz1z2Vs9g

can you listen to spiral knights music over and over again for hours in game and not get bored of it? is it that great and unique?

look at this person here. the melody was originally from Nightmare before christmas - this is halloween. however, he made the music and video match together with the ideas and concept of the game and it fits. it shows that aperture is a krazy place and thats how he intended it to be.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZIVmKOdrBk

yes spiral knights music does fit the game, but it isnt that great. after a short time it gets lame.

i am sure i can produce better music... and no i wont waste my time proving it to you.

Sat, 09/08/2012 - 13:34

#50

Virtuewis

@ Vluxor

"isn't that great" and "gets lame" are subjective terms... I don't know what you are trying to accomplish other than informing us of YOUR (negative) opinion. I am sure that you can produce "better" music... as long as "better" means the same as the above terms... to YOUR taste lol... Your opinion matters, but stating it like it's the end all be all fact, isn't going to do any good. If I'm in the studio and someone says... "make it sound better!" it's... kind of noobish of them lol... How "well the music is developed" is determined according to what standard? Surely you're not referring to motivic and thematic development, in which case the SK soundtrack blows that stuff out of the water. :P

For example:
I'm sure tons of Justin Bieber fans would think this game's soundtrack would be "better" and "not as lame" if it were replaced with Justin Bieber music.

Your opinion matters, but if you're going to take an authoritative position, you might want to keep your comments objective. I don't understand the point of saying something negative, unless you have a clear idea of WHAT it is that bothers you about it. So, my question to you would be: What is it specifically that you don't like about the music in SK? What, aesthetically, is holding it back from achieving what you think is achieved by those other soundtracks or songs? I noticed in all of the videos you linked, there were vocals (either as part of the song or as an announcer voice over). Is that what you like about them? Most people like music with some type of vocals, but keep in mind that there are many many fans of instrumental music as well!

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Music Discussion Thread. May the phrygian be with you. (This thread is scheduled to die when it leaves the front page.)