If anyone needs help with the new Battle Sprites, I'll be making a video and posting it here.

Here is some feedback on some of the stuff i have tested on various bits of the update

Battle Sprites
Each sprite will inevitably compared to the other, so balance SHOULD have been maded in that respect, instead from what i have seen, the sprites were made as a "theme" and balanced compared to their own skills, not to other sprites, because I can see skills where i would blatantly choose another sprite's skills instead

Drakon is all rounded okay, but what people don't realise is that the Drakon is less than mediocre and not really that great, it is only okay when compared to the Seraphynx

Firebolt is a ranged attack, which only augments swordsmans and bombers that dont carry a gun, which is okay

The problem is flame barrier, in a game like SK, the defining aspect whether a skill or an item is useful or not is its usability and performance. Flame barrier is neither, it is counterintuitive. In T3 depths you dont want to run into melee all the time, (unless you are a swordsman, even then you always take precaution). One auto attack will greatly surpass the damage of the orbiting orbs. In that case the damage part of it is useless since i can attack | shield | attack | shield faster than the orbs, ranged attacks are safer and provide better utility, bombs are just outright safer since you can charge and run. That leaves two parts of the shield to come into play, the enhances defense and burning targets. THe problem here is that SK is a game based of reactions and timing, say if you were about to take a trojan hit, do you want to A. Enhance your defense, or B. Block the attack with your shield. Id choose B anytime, because by the time i actually use and cast the flame barrier, the instance which it is useful for is gone. Combuster and Ash of Agni burns and deals more damage. This skill really is more of a "fun" aspect.

Seraphynx. Is. Crap
Ray of Light is Crap, Completely rework the range, casting and allow it to move and track targets during the duration

Heart attack is crap, The concept of it sounds nice, imbueing targets to drop hearts, but here again usability and performance. The AoE is stuck in a circle around me, what if i am a gunner? Am i forced to run into a mob just to make use of this skill? If im already low, that one hit will kill me, do i want to trade the risk ill die from an unpredictable projectile for the chance of extra hearts by running in and using this skill? Allow us to target where we want it to hit, and itll be better

Maskeraith
Quite honestly the only reasonable sprite to get, unless you are going for looks, because this is the ONLY spirite that provides something that items/gear in SK DOESN'T already provide. Maskeraith provides something for ANY knight setup, whether it be bombing, gunning or swordsman.

Energy Changes
2625 energy for each month left on your energy pass
87.5 energy per day, i earn more than that in one run. Stupidiesly low compensation

Difficulty Modes
Good changes, i like some new challenges

Item Changes
"Loot now drops for each member of a party and each party member must pick up their own loot. You now will earn the exact same amount of loot in a party as you do solo, so party up!"
I have seen some love and hate on this, personally, i hate most of it. Lets take vanaduke for example, probably the most well known and most run "mission" done. Everyone splits of after the first level because we trust eachother to get the rooms done and in a timely fashion. I dont want to babysit just to collect my loot when i could be making the run so much faster by clearing another room at the same time. If i will earn the exact amount of loot in my party, then why shouldnt i make it easier upon myself to solo, where things pratically die in nearly 1-2 shots and clear things faster? This isn't a "party because theres more benefits" kind of update, its a "party because you have to" one. But this does sort of force the group to stick together, so maybe itll work out better in the end.

UI Changes
Still havent provided us with the option of changing back to the old UI, quite dissapointed.

The Forge
This is quite possibly one of the most annoying changes i have ever seen. Interested, i decided to test this system. Now let us lay some facts out
SK has no lvling system, the lvling system is in the items heat lvl and building upon that, tier lvl
Progressing knights building upon that lvl going through runs and collecting heat
Now the ONLY way to lvl up heat is at these following places "town or at any arsenal station" Correct me if im wrong, but afaik arsenal stations are either at the beginning of a depth or the very end of a mission, which means that you CANNOT heat up and use the heat you have acquired in a mid run. That. Is. Stupid.
If i am heating my item, for me to 100% optimally use all the heat in runs, im required to go to haven and use the forge? lets say it requires 100 pieces of heat to heat my demo helm from lvl 4-5, lets say it is currently at lvl 4, with 95 pieces of heat, requiring 5 more. First depth of FSC provides say 50. There is only the arsenal station at the beginning, all 45 pieces of the heat i have earned BEFOREHAND is lost therefore i have to finish the depth, leave, heat it (and there is a chance that it FAILS to go to the next heat lvl). That is utterly really annoying. Who implemented this system? Do you even test these beforehand? I know that elevator costs are removed, so no pressure from using "ME" or "CE" for runs, but it is frustrating to know i could lose a lot of heat, requiring me to exit and reenter runs repeatedly if i am heating gear and knowing most runs dont have arsenal stations for 3-4 depths in a row. If you are adding this change, add an arsenal station at every depth or 2.

also FYI, my demo helm, recieved 5 failed forges in a row, before i successfully upgraded it.

These are just my thoughts and opinions

Can someone, maybe the Devs tell us what changed about them? If we were to find out we'd have to go down there ourselves and risk not having the materials required to craft them. I mean maybe I'll get them all by the time I get these orbs, but I want to know for sure.

HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE the "Forge!" THIRTY 4* Fire Crystals to guarantee leveling a 4* item from lvl 4 to 5, and if you're running tier 3, too bad, you only get 5* Fire Crystals. This is ON TOP OF having to gain the heat like before the change. The other changes are fine (so far), but this is ludicrous! Was it really too easy/fast to level gear before this?

The chances for the extra "bonuses" seem really low, especially considering how weak the bonuses are. Spending the MAX # of Fire Crystals (9ish for levels 2-4, 30 for level 5) each level while leveling my 4* bomb from 1 to 5 has gotten ONE 25% heat boost bonus (on level 2) and ZERO bonuses since then; none of the extra bonuses for spending all those crystals. I'm almost out, so I guess I'll have to cut back and take my chances with the RNG on even gaining a level... :( Yes, I know you can buy the fire crystals from the Supply Depot, but 350 energy for 50 is really steep, especially if you're using 30 per level, per item (and that's just for a 4* item, which you still have to level to 10 to craft into a 5* item).

On the positive side, on the highest difficulty, at least in normal clockworks levels, I'm finding more Sparks of Life than I use, so I'll probably never have to spend energy to revive. Granted, I'm a bit better at staying alive than most people.

UPDATE: Just did a Roarmulus Twins run to see if I could get 4* Fire Crystals...nope, only 3*. Maybe if I turn down the difficulty in tier 3?

On the test server, I took seven 5* items and heated them entirely to Heat 10 and used max fire crystals each time to level them.
All of the numbers discussed subsequently are at max (3x) fire crystal values.

Rewards:
In 63 attempts (7 items, 9 heat levels/item):
0 forge boxes, 5 +25% heat bonuses, 3 double levels (2 items skipped level 2, 1 skipped level 5).

Fire Crystal Economics using max crystals each forge: 3108 or average = 444 crystals / item.

Doing today's prestige mission on elite, I earned 12 5* crystals.
I'll just need to do that 258 more times.

Now - using max crystals is purely a player decision - but we've already had people post they've rolled minimum crystals 3x and not gotten the heating level up.

They may have also improved the bonus payout rates since testing.

The forge animation is really gorgeous but the mechanics behind it are not.

As I said, the difficulty option should be used for the challange, not for the money.

This is an amazing update, well done. Ive been with Spiral Knights from the very beginning and i have to say you took an older game and made it fun again.

I have 2 requests though regarding the current system;

(1) Add a sprite food alchemiser to the guild hall as an option.

(2) allow other players to enter the lab at the same time similar to the advanced training hall.

Other than that its been a blast, i like to consider myself a pro gammer and just finished up an elite run through firestorm citadel. It definetly wore the rust off.

I look forward to your upcoming content and hope to see some wonderful suprizes along the way.

Whats wrong with a SAO reference? SAO was the reason i actually got interested in this game, and its a good anime.

I can't seem to get 4* Shining Fire Crystals to drop anywhere. I ran through tier 3 clockworks and only got 5* Radiant Fire Crystals. Roarmulus and Royal Jelly levels only drop 3* ones. Am I missing something, or is this bugged?

I'm liking the rest of the update, but this Forge thing is seriously ticking me off.

I have two MAJOR annoyances with the update.
I don't know about other people, but when I get annoyed by the experience? That's when I stop playing games. Not a threat, just trying to explain that these issues are serious to me (and likely others as well).

****Collecting Cr/Heat/Mats****
SUCH a PAIN now! It's annoying and slow to have to backtrack over every step, and making sure someone else in the party didn't kill something in a corner, etc.

Either add a "treasure indicator" on the map so I know to backtrack, or let everyone pick up the Cr/Heat/Mats for everyone. You can leave pills/vials/vitas separate.

****The Red Flash****
I already KNOW I got hit. You don't need to emphasize the point more!

I know I got hit because I (1) saw my avatar flicker invincibly (2) health rectangles fell off my character (3) my health bar decreased and (4) I'm actually paying attention while I play. The red is unnecessary and DISTRACTING!

Oh, and the slow pulse when your health gets low? How does blocking part of the screen HELP ME when I'm low on health and about to die? Answer: it doesn't.

Make the red flash optional!

Other than that, I'm enjoying the update. Great job on everything else, guys!
Thanks!

You name your sprite by selecting it in the inventory.

From what I see from the comments so far, I'm seriously reconsidering playing Spiral Knights. Reduce these problems, devs, and everybody will be happy.

Why oh why oh whyy did my computer die the day before the update. Life's so cruel /sad

Update sounds good.

"- Some rare monsters now have a chance to drop new items."

Now, anyone encountered any of these yet?

Bring it back! You don't know how many times I die in Jelly King!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9KyBdPeKHg

I love this update. A lot of people will rage but that's only because people don't like it when things are different
My favourite things about the update are:
- There is no longer a crown fee for joining Arcade Gates.
- New scenario rooms have been added.
------------------
- Removed "Securing the Camp" mission
WHY WOULD YOU DO THIS?

- i cant buy more then one material at a time at brink (using sparks)
-update the wiki with info where to find new materials, especially shining fire crystals (if im correct i wasnt able to find it on missions-T3)

i'm having trouble using my sprite's attack... any suggestions how can i effectively use it?

Is different loot on same party intented behaviour? Because for me - it's not

Edit: ^ - you can swap them between slots

Oh, yeah, that's true, thanks. But anyway, I can't share them with my party mates now.

If this is the place for feedback and suggestion directly related this this update:

Emergency revive problems:

The emergency revive activates automatically shortly after dying, which means it will activates even when a player is linkdead. If the player then dies again before reconnecting, then the emergency revive has been effectively been wasted. Recommended solution: wait for player input to active the emergency revive.

The emergency revive does not knock enemies back upon activation. The player can be trapped in a corner or against a wall, die, the emergency revive is used, and player is still trapped to be killed again--this was the very reason that the knockback and stun benefits were applies to energy revives. Solution: add at the very least the knockback benefits to the emergency revive.

Relatively minor issues stemming from this update:

The report screen upon finishing an expedition could use alterations given importance of items found in the clockworks. Sparks of Life are listed at the bottom (along with the rare equipment piece, which has been the case before this update), and I have often found it difficult to quickly click through the items found before the timer expires. If I may suggest: at the very least, move Sparks of Life near the top? How about increasing the amount before forcing the player to leave the screen, or adding a scroll bar, or perhaps if the player is not in a full party than utilize more than one column in the report.

I play at a 800px height resolution, and had kept all Arsenal tabs closed except for Minerals; before this update this allowed me to open the Arsenal and quickly see the amount of all five minerals gathered, and I would do so in the clockworks to pick up the one in least supply if there were minerals of the different colors but the same size present. The addition of the Battle Sprite and Rarity menus push the Mineral tab lower, no longer allowing me to do this. If I may suggest: let the position of the scroll bar in the Arsenal menu be saved, so that when opening it it returned the same spot.

Repeating what others have said, to add my agreement:

Give the player the option to toggle the redness around the screen when hit and at low health. I feel that this is distracting.

Heal the player to full red-pip health if the emergency revive was not used that depth, as there is now a benefit to killing yourself for that health at the end of a depth if it hasn't been used.

Allow Maskewraithe's quill attack to trip switches and trigger explosive blocks, akin to a pot or vial.

Wait for player input on cutscenes where there is dialog to be read.

And finally for the time being, I am restraining myself in saying that I am not a fan of the new item leveling system, particularly where any heat gained in excess of that which is required to level an item is lost. I also hear the crystal costs become quite brutal, and I find the incorporation of gambling in this integral part of advancement through the random element of failure to be highly disrespectful to the player.

As the subject would say, this is how I'm feeling.

I'm glad that spiral knights is moving forward with updates and involving players to open discussions and ask questions about this update...

My problems however are these: Heat levels now take forever to grind up to (higher rank gear), you can no longer revive teammates with hearts (has to be SoL only now, SoL = Sparks of Life), If you are dead when someone picks up the boss coins...The dead person doesn't receive them, The drops aren't the same across the board for players in party (random generations for each player).

But, I'm glad however it seems that Spiral Knights has taken a more free to play path (in my opinion). I would love to see more levels and possibly depths or anything else that comes to this game. But, this may be some things to fix first with this update...

Thanks for reading just some of my personal views.

I gotta agree with a load of the complaints mentioned here and in other threads, theres some great new features in the game now but they've also added loads of majorly bad things.

This new item leveling system is just awful, that forge system is a major rip. All that work myself and others put in to getting our gear leveled up (specially now since that newbies will get better chances of getting bonuses on their gear from the get-go, but for us players that have 4 star or 5 star items already we're a bit screwed really and have lost out on loads), or close to level up, just so that when this new patch comes in we're now told sorry but it was all for nothing and now we're gonna charge you not only heat but mats to POSSIBLY level up (not definite anymore, you can possibly fail and thus have to re-try again and again and again, eurgh... screw that!).
Like I've got most of my gear on one character up to level 10 4 star, I only had a 3 star shield and a level 6 helm. But when this new system came in, now I'm stuck with a level 6 4 star helm because I need to get shining fire crystals... I got loads of mats given because of the patch, but not a single shining fire crystal? But yeah, overall that forge system, not a great idea. I like the chances of maybe using the crystals to possibly get bonuses but howabouts if you just want to simply level up your gear so you can craft the next star up item? Howabouts making it so that people can at least level up their gear WITHOUT needing the crystals, BUT make the crystals/etc OPTIONAL so that if people want to TRY to get extra bonuses then they can use/need crystals to spin the roulette wheel of fate to see if they will get a bonus or not. That way its kinda like the old system which was purely heat based (which was great) but still has this forge system for those people who want to try to get bonus boosts on their gear? A sort of best of both thing?

The pets systems a nice feature, nothing new since its obviously just copied from the numerous other games out there that all did the same thing but still its nice to have a little help (note little, as the pets as-is are rather rubbish til you get them highly leveled up... which again takes loads and loads of mats and loads of time... eurgh).

But in regards to the pets, that selection process was a bit rubbish. Some people have had problems where they selected a pet and got the wrong one somehow. I myself actually (and I'm totally embarrassed to admit this) messed up an clicked accept on the dragon one all because I sneezed an mis-clicked, LAWL! So am really REALLY hoping that the devs put in the ability to trade back the pet or swap it or something. I know that in the future they've stated they'll add a system where you can get more pets but that still means many people are currently stuck with either the wrong pet or a pet that turns out to be utterly rubbish and not what they're after.

I was talking to a friend about the pets and came up with a few ideas in regards to a better "trial" system or something. One idea was that you were allowed to have the pet for a few hours or a day, or limited amounts of exchanges/etc, or so to see if you really liked it (but you couldn't level it up - thus wasting mats - unless you committed totally) because theres only so much that you can do in re-doing those rather tedious and annoying missions over and over specially since you have to put up with that lecture from the npc over and over which you can't skip or skim past/etc (devs, please please please put in some bypass code or click to speed up, etc!).

Another idea was that maybe you could buy an item to deprogram the pet so you could take it back, but of course that'd have to be like an item you'd have to fork out a load of energy for or a load of crowns, etc. But still, least it'd mean people wouldn't be stuck with the same pet over an over til whenever new pets are added or the new system to be allowed to get more pets in your inventory/arsenal/etc.

As for screen flash, etc, yup totally annoying. We need more graphics options, such as the ability to toggle annoying garbage like that. Sure some people may like it, but from what I'm reading most hate it.

I like the idea of everyone gets the same loot now, but not the fact that everyone sees only whats dropped on their screens meaning you have to wait for the rest of the party to go explore everywhere else that you may already have been to just so they can get the drops too. It'd be better to maybe merge the old system where anyone could pick stuff up, but mix it in with this everyone gets the same loot system. That way it'd be more efficient and better teamwork based perhaps? Least it'd stop people moaning because of having to wait for one or two people to go all the way back down a side corridor to see if they missed something, etc. Course theres still the issue of the pot drops, which it appears you can now no longer drop from your inventory. Which seems to me that you can no longer drop them for the other party members to pick up, etc. Which kinda screws with the whole teamwork premise doesn't it? Or is that just a bug and you'll re-add the potion dropping ability to let us share/swap potions with each other, specially for things like health potions, etc.

All these new features are great, but theres still loads of ancient bugs that have yet to be addressed/fixed, such as the old unable to join friends/guild members even though they are set to joinable. And from what I've read thats been around for over 3 years now and still to be fixed/addressed.

I can see that the price to buy energy is slowly dropping, but I'd love to know how the devs worked out the prices to buy items in the depot/etc because it starts at like 65 energy for a 1 star item, then its 150 for 2 star, 500 for 3 star, 1,600 for 4 star... ??? How's that worked out exactly? Same principle with recipes/etc, prices rocket up. Which is all fine, as you can still work an play loads to get them sooner or later but its a bit weird the price jumps.

I have to also agree with the people saying about the new UI for the equipment/etc, its a mess atm. Having the equipment/costume separate then having to open yet another window to view the progress/achievements area... Why? Why couldn't you just add a new tab or expand the old UI for that area just to add the new sprite interface?

Also in regards to the item crafting system now, before we could trade ALL the mats including crystal energy with people who could craft items for us and then they could trade the crafted item back... now we can't exactly because the final mat required is non-tradeable... You can still trade all the other mats, and the item crafted is tradable, but its somewhat of a rip because your technically losing out because of having to farm those non-tradeable mats again. Or is there a way to mark the mats tradeable like the way you can unbind items? Or perhaps can you make it like on some games where you can LOAN people mats/items, so they can craft you the item your after? EG a trade system as such, where they link the item your wanting crafting via its recipe, and then you put in all the mats required (but they're sort of marked still as owned by you, but not bound, so that they can't be stolen an then traded off to others/etc) then the other person (the one who has the recipe) can then craft the item for you (again its marked as owned by you somehow, but not bound so you can optionally equip and thus it gets bound or you can trade it/sell it in the market/etc). Would that be a better alternative? As it works in other games I've seen, so should be useful here, as at least it'd mean the crafting system wouldn't be completely rubbish or a major rip.

Overall, some nice new features, but generally loads of bad stuff added thats making myself and numerous others ponder leaving. So I hope the devs read all the replies to this thread, specially ones such as mine and others that have got some useful tips/suggestions/comments/criticisms and so on and reply or at least read/listen and act upon. :-)

Vials and Capsules are actually instanced per player. Where you see a vial drop, the other players probably see nothing.

I am not a picky person. I can live with most of the new changes, and they're quite nice overall.

But find me a Vanguard who actually likes the new Forge feature and I will accept it.

This would have been easily been shown to be a huge negative if it was tested during earlier stages of preview server. It's taking something good and simple and making it worse with no actual benefit.

There's no benefit to forging at <100% unless you actually make the bonuses better than what you get with guaranteed success. The correct leveling scheme should have been:

1. 1x for 100% success, no bonuses other than standard: good for people who just want to get a weapon leveled quickly
2. 2x for 60% success, plus a low UV or at least higher chance of UV
3. 3x for 30% success, plus a mid-high UV, or at least higher chance than 60% one, or guarantee 2 UV, whatever

There's no incentive to roll lower success rates if bonuses are less than the higher success rate one. Would you buy a lotto ticket if it paid less than your job? What's the incentive?

I would be very excited if forging became a new means of gaining more UVs reliably, because as an end-game player, collecting and obtaining powerful UVs is really the only thing left to do. And with the forge system the way it is, Punch may just be the only friend I have left in Haven.