So Radiant Fire Crystal drop rates have been increased huh?
increased drop chance.
chance.
B|
Drop rates have been increased at earlier depths.
Its still not high enough to be honest.
Regardless of whether it is a chance, or if you get the right stage, the issue has not been resolved because farming for radiants is still a relatively time consuming experience. Not like "farm for a week" or anything, like "farm for a month per item". Which is absurd.
Whats wrong with that, is that it forces us to play for only 2 depths in the game- D27 and D28. I can't do T2, or play the danger mission or any of that if I want to make new gear. I don't want to choose between having a good time with friends and getting somewhere.
It's either farm them or buy em'. If they would drop like crazy, then we could bring the old system back instead. (i don't see a point in the new system, but w/e)
They should make it so the fire crystals drop ONLY in their specific stratums. Think about it, there's 6 different variants of fire crystals and 6 stratums in total. The drops should go like this:
Stratum 1 (Depth 0-3): Cracked Fire Crystal
Stratum 2 (Depth 5-7): Dim Fire Crystal
Stratum 3 (Depth 9-12): Warm Fire Crystal
Stratum 4 (Depth 14-17): Glowing Fire Crystal
Stratum 5 (Depth 19-22): Shining Fire Crystal
Stratum 6 (Depth 24-28): Radiant Fire Crystal
We shouldn't be getting shinings from stratum 6 at all, really. The radiants only drop from Depth 26-28 (If you're lucky, unlike me clearly). It would just make more sense to balance them out between the depths accordingly. But what's that? Balance? LOL! Things are so balanced in Spiral Knights, especially the Blitz Needle.
"The radiants only drop from Depth 26-28"
But Radiants drop at Depth 25 onward, not Depth 26.
I definitely seen a better drop.
Look. There is a reason radiants appear from depth 25 and up. When the forge update first came, defender elites had serious problems getting to Vanguard because of no shining crystals in the levels they tended to roam. Vanguards had the shining crystal recipes, and there was an abundance of radiants so they could easily make em'. Having it like it is right now is more than fine to me.
"better" drop rates doesn't mean much when they still appear FAR less than shinings. How is it fair that shining fire crystals drop anywhere from depth 19 to the core, and radiants only drop 26 and deeper (maybe 25 if you're SUPER lucky...)
I have perhaps 10+ items I need to heat. That totals probably over 1500 rads. you know how many I get on an average tier 3 run? A measly 18.
I swear it was way better when the forge was newly introduced.
a Level 10 5* Gear shouldnt be this hard to obtain, i actually get annoyed when i see all the defender elites and champions & tbh all players below vanguard rank that don't have access to vana.. i average about 10-18 radiants per run, and it takes 453 radiants to max a 5* gear.. hmmm i do prefer gettin nearly 20 per run though rather than 3-6 per run.
@ Khomie You forgot to say on what difficulty you went on.
Eye get +60 radiants in average on elite difficulty.
(Check my other screenshots for goodies. ^^)
The drop rate HAS been increased, I personally found rads on d25 after the patch on the first day like 2x (only 3 each, but still). Now I can simply go on other rank 9 missions, besides than fsc, and have a shot to find rads. Oh, not to mention the dm-s <3. And my average on ufsc is moving towards +70.
Speaking of which, I have still have like a dozen keys, fee is 20k cr/run, on eu server, difficulty is ofc elite, gear and/or experience is required, send a tell if any of you guys are interested.
PS. Radiant drops were moved closer to the core due to the after the fsc/core missions. We will have ample of chance to get rads there, sometime in the distant future...
It was still ever so stupid of them to move the rates preemptively, during autumn, when depths after d29 are not even out... (Besides the Aftermath of och, which is, technically d30 and the end of the apocrea mission.)
funny bug due to the after core stuff
These runs are from d19 to d29 right? How long does it take? Or is it not?
Yes, we start from Emberlight (u can choose to join in later, but it is advised to come along startum 5 to get pills and such - I ask for the money at the terminal anyways). The run is, erm, about 1,5-2 hours, depends on the members.
You get an average of 20k cr plus the 6 tokens, and the tear, and obvioulsy, them ~60 rads, so is well worth it. (actually I used to ask for 30k, but since energy prices have dropped, I lowered the price)
Previous severe radiant drought: Practical forging up to level 4
Current moderate radiant drought: Practical forging up to level 7
>only 2 depths in the game- D27 and D28.
It now drops from depth 26 and below now, but it's still not guaranteed that the crystals are radiant type and the drop rate itself is still not like before the drought, which is awful. Forge should just need one type of crystal for the whole arsenal. At least we could make progress anywhere.
>Ardent-Light
They could just play on the stratum 5 to get said crystals, that's what I did when the forge was introduced. There's no justifiable reason for the radiant drought other than the devs' own greed.
@Altmetal
I always play on elite. Look at how many crowns I got. You wouldn't get that much from a typical depth 19-UFSC run on normal.
I forget. But I do remember that it was before the tier 3 clockwork terminal.
I'm perfectly happy with the forge now. I'm getting into clockwork runs again.
Why is there such an urgency in getting all your 5-star gear to level 10 in the first place? It's not like there's some magical content barrier that you can only access at that point...hell, you've already passed the barrier just by virtue of having a 5-star loadout. I understand that there's a bonus nerf going from a level 10 4-star item to a level 1 5-star, but you get half of that bonus back by level 5, and you can get enough Radiants for that from a handful of regular Stratum 6 runs. My current strategy is to get all the 5-star gear I craft to level 5, and then just concentrate on working a single one to level 10 at a time; sure it takes a while, but it gets there eventually. There's not some earth-shattering difference between level 5 and level 10 5-star items, so where's the huge rush?
Wow, I've actually gotten MORE Radiants than Shinings from FSC runs, and I'm usually unluckier about rare drops than most. I haven't done a SL run since before the initial Radiant nerf, though, so I guess I can't speak for those.
Pdtopgun - People like instant gratification. Heaven forbid they have to work at something and not instantly have the best gear.
People are so incredibly defeatist. It's entirely possible to strike a balance with playing with friends and making new gear. Heck, my friends and I frequently do runs together while we're heating new gear. It's really fun to roll on Forges together to see who gets bonuses and who can finish their gear first. :B oh no I can't play with friends if I wanna heat stuff. whatevah.
Bombs.
Natural charge time reductions are really mandatory for a bomber, and it's very painful to try to level up a few bombs at once.
However, the current drop rates are really nice. Sure I got only three radiants from a Vanaduke run yesterday, but I got 45 from the diamond king gate the day before. It's also friendlier for newer players who need shining fire crystals still. My only change would have radiants be the only fire crystal at depth 28.
It's possible.
Derp
I call lies
Some gates don't give much radiant fire crystals at all. For instance, if Stratum 6 is a beast stratum, then you'll unlikely get any radiants, unless of course, it's a clockworks tunnel or path.
That depth reads 25, not 24.
@Skyguarder
Check my current "box rate" ranking here. Deconstruction zones, compounds, graveyards, and devilite areas (Dark City + Devilish Drudgery) areas are currently ranked worse than wolver dens. Then again, theres just a big lump near the middle average (~9 boxes per depth).
The SL depth when roaming around, the boxes are 100% radiant fire crystals for sure, no joke about it. Saw them in my first run down Darkfire Vanaduke lair. Though if you're will to spend are the time getting shadow key to get there.
After 40+ vana runs, I've found an average of ~20 radiants per run. Its far more than before, and I've been able to heat every 5* thing that I was never able to before.
Just because you happened to get one run that had a low amount of radiants says nothing about the overall rate. I've had runs with only 3 radiants after the patch, but other runs with over 30.
I find them mostly on D26-28, with an occasional one on d25
Hi.
Are these vana runs mission only, so depth 23-29? Or are you doing arcade from depth 19 to 29?
Edit: is it on Elite? Are you soloing?
Batabii: "I have perhaps 10+ items I need to heat. That totals probably over 1500 rads. you know how many I get on an average tier 3 run? A measly 18.
I swear it was way better when the forge was newly introduced."
I have exactly fifteen items that need to be heated right now, one of which is only halfway done because of OOO withholding (and continuing to withhold) Radiants from all but the lowest depths of the Clockworks. What's worse is, there are five items not even on that particular list, thanks entirely to their enforced "drought". Minus those items, I would only need 6,650 Radiant Fire Crystals, but with them, I would require close to 9,000. So yes, I most certainly agree that things were a lot better when the Forge was first introduced.
Khomie: "They should make it so the fire crystals drop ONLY in their specific stratums. Think about it, there's 6 different variants of fire crystals and 6 stratums in total.........We shouldn't be getting shinings from stratum 6 at all, really."
THIS. Neither I nor anyone else in this game should ever even have to see a Shining Fire Crystal in an area where there should clearly be nothing but Radiants, and absolutely nothing else but those.
Having fire crystals drop in their specific Stratum levels is a very good idea. I know OOO likes stacking the odds against us. Maybe instead of a 100% chance we get say RFC in stratum 6. We get a 95% chance with a 1% for the other 5 lower types. In stratum 5 we get a 96% chance of Shining Fire Crystals with a 1% chance of getting the other 4 lower ones. So in summary
+ Stratum 1 — Depth: 01-03 (Tier 1) ~ 100% Cracked Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 2 — Depth: 05-07 (Tier 1) ~ 99% Dim Fire Crystal / 1% Cracked Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 3 — Depth: 09-12 (Tier 2) ~ 98% Warm Fire Crystal / 1% Dim Fire Crystal / 1% Cracked Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 4 — Depth: 14-17 (Tier 2) ~ 97% Glowing Fire Crystal / 1% Warm Fire Crystal / 1% Dim Fire Crystal / 1% Cracked Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 5 — Depth: 19-22 (Tier 3) ~ 96% Shining Fire Crystal / 1% Glowing Fire Crystal / 1% Warm Fire Crystal / 1% Dim Fire Crystal / 1% Cracked Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 6 — Depth: 24-28 (Tier 3) ~ 95% Radiant Fire Crystal / 1% Shining Fire Crystal / 1% Glowing Fire Crystal / 1% Warm Fire Crystal / 1% Dim Fire Crystal / 1% Cracked Fire Crystal
OR (I prefer this way)
+ Stratum 1 — Depth: 01-03 (Tier 1) ~ 100% Cracked Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 2 — Depth: 05-07 (Tier 1) ~ 90% Dim Fire Crystal / 10% Cracked Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 3 — Depth: 09-12 (Tier 2) ~ 90% Warm Fire Crystal / 10% Dim Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 4 — Depth: 14-17 (Tier 2) ~ 90% Glowing Fire Crystal / 10% Warm Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 5 — Depth: 19-22 (Tier 3) ~ 90% Shining Fire Crystal / 10% Glowing Fire Crystal
+ Stratum 6 — Depth: 24-28 (Tier 3) ~ 90% Radiant Fire Crystal / 10% Shining Fire Crystal
Altmetal, I call shenanegans. Unless those were shadow lair runs, there's no way you got 60 rads in a single go. I play elite every single time and never get half that.
You are probably feeling very, very stupid right now.
(duh, even the original post relates to that place)
Yes, I realize that its possible to find them on D25 and D26, but the occurrence is still relatively rare compared to what it needs to be, and D27 and D28 are the only two depths that guarantee a decent number of radiants, provided you milk them for all the boxes they can possibly hold. That is to say that a clockwork tunnels/arena on D27/D28 has a higher radiant payout then a danger mission ending on D26.
And its hard not to be defeatist when I have to re-earn the 20+ items that I paid energy for prior to the update, but didn't have time to heat due to just using them whenever I played levels that fit them rather than grinding for that heat.
i still find radiants kind of rare. then again i shouldn't be saying that because two fsc runs ago i got 34 radiants...
The problem is only with Radiants isn't it?
This was solo elite vana mission, yes.
The drop rate on d25 appears to be somewhat similar to the old d27 rate: not impossible, but extremely rare.
In my opinion, we should be grateful that OOO listens to the (many) complaints and responded instead of complaining more...
On one hand yeah, I am quite glad that they cared enough to respond and put more of them out there.
On the other, they didn't exactly fix anything, and the problem is still present. Plus they released that awful shield.
People complain about radiants because they have plenty of weapons that they could have at 5* and cannot upgrade because they are mostly complete crap unless heated to a very high level. They also complain because the most efficient way to get radiants for most players is to endlessly farm Vanaduke (or SL Vana with 4* weapons) for a very long period of time.
Three Rings needs to better balance rewards so that players can have more variety without a significant drop in revenue. Operation Crimson Hammer is tier 3 paid expansion, but it is only worth it to get the rewards. The arcade and danger missions were a joke to get radiants before the update, and it probably still isn't that good. I haven't felt like playing much lately because of FSC grinding before the update.
@manor - You bring up a very good point. FSC really is the dominant method of earning revenue, and is even more important now with access to greater numbers of radiants but it would get extremely tedious after a number of times. It would be very nice to add another viable option for cr/radiant grinding. Hopefully that will be included in the fabled arcade revamp.
@ Fehzor - From what I can tell, they did increase the overall amount of radiants found by a significant (~3x) amount. Whether we all wanted more from them is subjective, and everyone can believe what they want.
Also, I agree that the new shield sucks. Just do what we normally do with bad things and don't use them.
Three Rings needs to better balance rewards so that players can have more variety without a significant drop in revenue.
I've been saying this for years...I've intentionally avoided FSC ever since the sprite update because I'm sick to death of it.
A friend of mine just did FSC on elite mode. He got 30 rads! However I did FSC on elite from D24-D27 and got like 18-22 Shinings! So are rads only a d28 thing?
"A friend of mine just did FSC on elite mode. He got 30 rads! However I did FSC on elite from D24-D27 and got like 18-22 Shinings! So are rads only a d28 thing?"
And I'm over here running the Arcade, getting at least 15 Radiants per run, usually about 25 or so.
I did an arcade run today as well. D19 to the core. I got 6 rads.
"I did an arcade run today as well. D19 to the core. I got 6 rads."
Still better than 3.
If you're running clockwork tunnels, arenas, or other box-rich levels, then you'll easily get at least 20 radiants. If you're running through compounds, not so much.
^Which is a problem in itself. I don't want to have to wait 2-3 times every single run, that isn't me having a good time. I just want to go and not have to worry that the level I'm going into will have next to no payout.
Theres a lot more good depths than just those.
I've started ranking the depths by different measurements (avg treasure boxes and crowns).
A big one that I would not have guessed previously is aurora isles and scarlet fortress themes.
Top 5 for boxes are currently: Arena, Clockwork Tunnels, Aurora Isles, Treasure Vaults, and Scarlet Fortresses. [Vault ranks best for red]
Worst 5 for boxes are currently: Compounds, Graveyards, Deconstruction Zones, Dark Cities, Devilish Drudgeries, and Wolver Dens.
Since there are only 5 left, those are middle, obviously.
The main problem is that mission boss runs often are better just because they are an even stratum (more crowns) and have average boxes beating the depth types below the top 8.
I saw your data and you're certainly right.. but every other gate still seems to end in a large number of compounds/decon zones. I find this to be relatively frustrating, as it makes the gates almost entirely unrewarding. The ones that don't seem to always require me to wait on the gate to change.
I guess this happens because of the levels you listed as good:
Top 5 for boxes are currently:
Arena = Spawns with compounds/decon zones, requires waiting.
Clockwork Tunnels = Spawns with compounds/decon zones, requires waiting.
Treasure Vaults = unreliable due to graveyards
Scarlet Fortresses = specific to one monster family, and so rarer than it would otherwise be
Aurora Isles = Is reasonable, but still has a lesser chance of spawning
So 3/5 are quite shaky, and 2/5 have a smaller chance of spawning.
and people STILL try to send complaints to OOO about radiants
It's a chance for it to drop, not absoulutly certain. Sometimes you get no radiants, sometimes you get a lot