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Some bombs suggestions to make them more useful.

3 replies [Last post]
Tue, 10/30/2012 - 09:57
Dead-Bard's picture
Dead-Bard

Well, I've recently switched from Swordie to (wannabe) bomber and in the making I noticed that this "Class" is hugely underpowered compared to Swordie and Gunnah, so here I'll post some suggestions to make them on par with the other two, expecially DPS-wise.

Add a normal blast Shadow & Elemental bomb such as the DBB, expecially elemental; shadow isn't such an issue since the DR is a good DPS bomb already although quite situational.

Rethink the whole way shard bombs work or buff their damage.
Srsly? a DPS bomb dealing 180dmg/shard to 6th stratus mobs that are WEAK to it? I saw some videos of the old shard bombs and thought that the old mechanic with the current dmg/shard could be a good option, or the current mechanic with the old damage/shard (well, maybe not exactly the same dmg, probably a bit less would be good already).

Increase the bomb damage bonuses bombs on Mad Bomber and Bombastic sets, I noticed at my own expenses that the damage increase on MadB isn't really worth all those negative statuses, you get over 10 seconds of fire, poison, freeze and about 6-7 seconds of stun just to deal about 40-50 dmg more of 6th stratus, and as for Bombastic the damage bonus doesn't really stand against the CTR reduction of both Vdemo and MadDemo, and considering that CTR also greatly affects status bombs...

All in all, haze bombs are already great as they are, but DPS bombs really suck, many hybrid-bombers won't mind since the best bombs to use with an hybrid setup are all status bombs, but for a full-bomber the lack of DPS really is something bothersome, a good way to turn this around without messing too much with all the stuff involved would probably be to leave every bomb as it is (except for shards) and give a major boost to the dmg bonus on bombs given by MadB, Bombastic, Boom trinkets and UVs, I don't mean "Make them high instead of medium" I mean increasing the damage per tier, so that they still keep the Bonus as it is (I.E. Medium bonus for the sets) but deal more damage with it (I.E. 100-120 more dmg for a full Bomba/Mad set instead of 50-60)

That's pretty much it please feel free to comment and post your own suggestions on the issue or simply tell me I'm [silly] and I shouldn't be allowed anywhere near the suggestion forum.

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 09:59
#1
Dead-Bard's picture
Dead-Bard
D:<

EDIT: Failposted.

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 11:29
#2
Luguiru's picture
Luguiru
Explosive diarrhea

Bombing has several factors in play when trying to balance. The first thing is damage over time. Bombs are for area of effect, so you have to compare a bomb using against several enemies at once; at least three. If you compare a sword to a bomb against only one enemy the bomb is always going to be downplayed because its major advantage is completely ignored while used against only one target. By the same side of the coin, swords also have area of effect but not to the same degree as bombs usually. This is where balance comes in. If bombs are supposed to have the highest area of effect, why do some swords have nearly the same area of effect? That means you, DAvenger.

On the contrary, all we need for the standard mechanic is for Nitronome to have its animation toned down. Specialized damage is supposed to be special to more situational bombs, though Three Rings has proven their incompetence in bombing when they made a specialized version of each damage type with the new shard bombs. Are sword users asking for piercing Brandishes? Well, yes; but they always get rejected. Mostly because Flourish already exists and has a viable mechanic whereas bombs require more intelligence to use without dying constantly.

No one can deny the new shard bombs are awful. Three Rings nerfed them because they competed in offense with swords, their precious favorite child, so they cut its limbs off and call it horseplay. If you want my thoughts on them see here, or see here for what Fehzor has to say. There are dozens of threads on fixing them, especially this where they gave an answer which basically said they hate bombs and can do whatever they want. Basically. Also see this. If anyone else wants to start a bomber riot on their building, be sure to call me. I have two fists and an unlimited supply of headbutts.

As a starting bomber you should not be using MadB until you can dodge well enough that >80% of the time you use your shield is to bump things strategically, like into a placed Graviton and not just away from you. Once you have refined your bombing abilities you are ready for the mohawk. This greatly contrasts with the instant gratification for offense Skolver gives, but remember as a bomber you should be able to dodge and shield while the simpletons with their metal sticks are busy hitting rocks. The armor sets for both SDemo and Wolver lines are fine on paper, but in practice the problem is with the weapons.

Again, the problem is with the individual bombs, not the armor set bonuses. If you compare Bombastic and Skolver, the only difference is the specialized defense type. If you compare Vog Cub with VDemo, they are practically cousins. Which brings us to yet another repeat topic: why do Wolver and Gunslinger branches at 5* have variated specialized defenses while SDemo lines all have split normal-element? Every time the topic comes up people always want Bombastic to switch its element defense for pierce and MadB switch its element defense for shadow. Every time. And I remember seeing at least four threads within a few months. Same results. Cataclysmic coincidences, Batman.

At the end of the day, the real problem is the weapons. The armor sets are fine in terms of the bonuses they give, though not necessarily defenses (weapon specialist lines have too much defense compared to the alleged 'tanking' lines; Skelly, Jelly, Magic, Plate). Nerfs for overpowered weapons and buffs for underpowered weapons. Armor could also use rebalancing.

Tue, 10/30/2012 - 12:36
#3
Dead-Bard's picture
Dead-Bard
Yeah, I do agree that sets

Yeah, I do agree that sets aren't as much of an issue here as the bombs themselves, what I was trying to accomplish by suggesting a boost to dmg given by sets is to make all bombs way more useful for pure bombers without making them also game-fanta-super-cosmo-breakingly powerful for your occasional bomber.

Afterall if you go for pure bomber you have to accept that even if you equip a whole fortress with cannons and boiling oil pots as your shield you'll have the same results as if you were to equip a paper-plane, which means that your whole survivability comes from your set, which, in the particular case of MadB, gives you the same chances of surviving as shouting "White Power" in a not so friendly black neighboorhood, so the tradeoff for that should be much more than just a lil' more damage.

Although as I probably already mentioned, this would be more of a shortcut than a real rebalance which should be applied to bombs themselves, even not having other regular-blast bombs with ele and shadow would be fine if the shards weren't so overwelmingly underpowered since they pretty much cover half of your happy-go-lucky bombing options.

In the end I knew there were probably a [crap]-ton of other topics about it (honestly I was kinda waiting for your reply that would link me to each and every of the important ones, I was not disappointed) but a reminder to OOO can't do bad, expecially since it'll make 'em know there are still bombers out there struggling to be on par with other classes and not all of us gave up on it to pick up their toothpick.

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