"Lol zeddy, we all know what the new guns will be. You can be spoilery here."
I don't... but spoil away (unless you're worried about getting banned, then be sneaky-sneaky all you like).
PSA: Your triple max skolver set is basically worthless (aka the Lockdown science megathread)
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:28
#52
@Feyi
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:37
#53
@Feyi-Feyi
I'm afraid the forum rules say otherwise. :\
@Khamsin
Your assumption is only partially accurate.
I did figure it out by looking at the guns in Spiral Spy, is the accurate part.
What I will say is that I'm not even going to bother with Lockdown when this release goes live. I have no interest in bombing LD with those guns around. No idea if other bombers will feel the same, but this particular VT spammer is done.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:43
#54
@Zeddy
Does spiral spy have the attack animations? I can't imagine the models themselves are enough to fear the new weapons, even if you know their damage type and what they proc. The only way I could see you being this scared is if they had attack animations, and one of them was some sort of cruel freezing polaris or something like that.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:44
#55
*Shudders*
Would these bomber murdering guns also impact T2 LD? This is exactly what I was afraid of when I heard of this update.....
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:45
#56
Boom!
Around 17 months ago, Aequitas found this out. 17 months later, the public finds out.
......
Just no.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:49
#57
@Zeddy
It is indicative that a bomber update will come soon after.
Right?
...right??
#54: *cough*
What I am interested in is what "changes to gun mechanics" they plan to implement. My eyebrows are in the furrowed position.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:51
#58
@Icegill
There used to be lots of interest in LD, but as it has died down and players have left the game, they've taken their knowledge with them. So it isn't surprising there has been knowledge that wasn't adequately preserved.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:57
#59
@Offense-Armor
Yes.
@Khamsin
I'm not saying we're getting a freezing Polaris, but fighting a mix of freezing and shock Polaris with various damage types sure would drain all the fun out LD for me.
@Icegill
Since I started this thread, I've had a lot of people come out and say they knew most of this already. I am basically the first person to actually bother sharing it. Since I don't really care that much for LD, I haven't really researched this until I just nearly accidentally did last week.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 12:57
#60
...
Well let's hope the bomber update (we must believe!) will give us some help against them ... I can't think of anything that would help against a freezing and shock Polaris with different damage types.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 13:02
#61
@Zeddy
"I'm not saying we're getting a freezing Polaris, but fighting a mix of freezing and shock Polaris with various damage types sure would drain all the fun out LD for me."
I'm guessing right now you're a mercurial demo bomber with a shock UV to be immune to polaris shock ATM, right? Yes, you'll probably have to adapt to the possibility of being status'd like the rest of us now, but that's not the worst thing in the world. Heck, freeze is probably one of the least threatening conditions a guardian bomber might have to deal with (as compared to say, stun), since you can block while stuck in place at least.
EDIT: Actually, you don't even have to adapt. Mix bombastic with MAX SHOCK MAX FREEZE with mercurial demo with MAX SHOCK MAX FREEZE and you should be good to go.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 13:08
#62
My merc demo only has curse high, normal medium, actually, and I usually play recon. I was getting pretty sick of Storm Drivers and Polaris so I was actually just about to make a Gray Feather set and see what I could do with it.
That plan's going down the drain now.
Also, I'm not saying we're getting a fourth Polaris, but four Polarises sure would suck.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 13:14
#63
.
There's a third polaris? Or really, what's the second for that matter (...what the heck is a supernova)?
Anyways, you never know in the future if we might get a shock/freeze resistance armor.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 13:21
#64
@Icegill
Everybody knows, nobody writes it down and publishes. A bit of a jerk move if you ask me. Making money by selling stuff like Piercing/Shadow Max Chaos gear and such is pretty friggin' terrible if you know about this. After all, the UV promises increased defences but in the end it doesn't under all circumstances. I'd say that's a scam by OOO but it doesn't seem like they care as they must've been aware of this when implementing the mechanics and feeding on this is just eh, no. No no no.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 13:27
#65
@krakob
This is exactly the thing I was talking about earlier. People consciously suppress information and sell items based on misinformation. Nobody wants to admit they're wrong for taking advantage of that though...
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 14:22
#66
Just by reading this thread and not having done any research... The game doesn't need another polaris. Fire ice or whatever. I had a dream where the polaris gun would be nerfed (hell if you take away the shock it'd still be a fierce weapon), but that dream is right up there with wishing for my iron slug to become a legit weapon overnight :).
Poo on dat!
I'm also gona whip out some ancient gear, very informative thread!
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 15:27
#67
Boom!
@Krakob: It isn't a scam at all. If you have elemental max on skolver, it's a situational loadout. It is the buyer's fault for not realizing that elemental defense will not defend against a flourish or a GF. Aequitas did not tell anyone because it was only important for our battles with Jempire. The Jemps didn't know about this either, no one did. Only a few select merchants, not going to mention names, took advantage of this because OOO never decided to tell anyone since it's pretty self explanatory. There is actually tons more to know about this, too. All of this is tangible, someone just needs to step up and do the math!
@Zeddy: Props to you for making people realize a bit more about LD, you've still got more digging to do though!
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 16:10
#68
^
You just won the internet
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 16:48
#69
.
" It is the buyer's fault for not realizing that elemental defense will not defend against a flourish or a GF. "
BUT HERES THE THING IT ISN'T SITUATIONAL IT IS USELESS IT PROVIDES NOTHING IN PVP NOT EVEN AGAINST COMBUSTER OR DA HERP DERP.
God, people in this game will do anything to justify to themselves their unethical behavior.
Anyways, after discussing with Zeddy in-game, I am expecting the worst for the future as well. If you're aren't immune to moderate freeze, PvP is gonna be hell. The true ice age is about to begin.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 16:57
#70
This is a rather big grey area to trek. Merchants knowingly withholding information that falls under the "i wish I knew" category can be considered scamming, yet the mechanics of this aren't outwardly revealed. Granted, lockdown is nothing more than a mini game, but how is it anybody's fault if they were unaware of a hidden mechanic?
Now that word is spreading more, is it bannable to merchant things intended to be useless uvs for "lockdown gear"?
Doubt it, but anything is possible.
Thu, 10/10/2013 - 20:21
#71
@Khamsin
Just seeing the new
@Khamsin
Just seeing the new guns actually does make me not want to bother with LD anymore.
I'll leave it at that.
Also: Feller, you'll have reason to get the Skolver back out soon enough.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 05:46
#72
I hit Krakob with a max damage rocket hammer while he was wearing full chaos and two elemental trinkets. He took 321 damage.
This puts a single trinket at somewhere around 16 defence.
In more understandable terms, you would need to get hit 15 times with an elemental weapon before a 5* trinket's defence would make up for the lack of 6 pips of health from a penta-heart.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 07:43
#73
I just saw the new handguns.
Vog help us all.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 08:21
#74
.
After some even further consideration, I don't even think the main issue is going to be the ice age... I think it will be what is effectively a 20-50 point damage boost to the other popular PvP gun. You're going to see a lot more gunners when a gun with vast moving projectiles and a large hitbox is hitting nearly as hard as a rapier on a skolver.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 08:26
#75
By the way, does anyone have
By the way, does anyone have the numbers of RAW DAMAGE of weapons in Lockdown?
BTB, Valiance, Sealed Swords, Brandishes, and Polaris. I'm sure it is possible to back them out somehow from numbers from smacking on mobs, but I dunno.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 08:33
#76
Am I a bad person for laughing at the thought of someone gunning with 4 Pulsars
Or 4 Blasters for that matter
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 09:21
#77
Not at all Whim, rest assure that player will be there.
My money is on Contri to be the first one!
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 09:29
#78
:D
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 10:01
#79
.
"Am I a bad person for laughing at the thought of someone gunning with 4 Pulsars"
Seems kind of dumb to me. One is gimped in PvP, and one doesn't interact positively with the other two good ones. I suspect we'll see something similar to storm/magma driver switching from skolvers in the future.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 10:07
#80
@Icegill
See, the problem here is that say, a Skolver coats claims to provide extra elemental defence but it does not in the end. That's false advertising. That's scamming. I don't think this is something up for discussion.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 10:10
#81
@Khamsin
Check the links at the beginning of this topic. The top values for each attack lists the raw damage.
Note how the raw damage for split-normal swords is obscene, and if you're using any sword except brandish or sealed for recon-work, you're doing it wrong.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 10:19
#82
@Zeddy
"Check the links at the beginning of this topic. The top values for each attack lists the raw damage."
Herp. Kind of feel bad that I skimmed over those, lol.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 10:35
#83
So far as I can tell,
So far as I can tell, blaster-style gunners are getting anywhere from 25% to essentially double damage boost depending on the armor and UV composition of the target they're shooting. Expect to see a lot more gunners in PvP when this patch hits IMO. I think that's a lot more scary than any pulsar-line spam usage.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 10:48
#84
I won't say the specifics, as I'm not entirely sure, but a friend of mine has reason to believe UVs are being removed from Lockdown entirely.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 10:55
#85
.
"I won't say the specifics, as I'm not entirely sure, but a friend of mine has reason to believe UVs are being removed from Lockdown entirely."
Yeah, that sounds like a load of bull**** to me. Dude, the amount of money people spent on UVs for lockdown... that just seems too radical.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 11:01
#86
Anything is possible if you dig deep enough.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 11:03
#87
@Whim
I mean, it isn't entirely impossible, they reduced the cost of shadow keys SUBSTANTIALLY, but at the same time... that just seems like too much. Too many whales would be angered by that move.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 12:14
#88
@Khamsin
You must not uave
@Khamsin
You must not uave been around for long...you think OOO wouod not remove UVs from LD?
Lets not forget, we are talking about the same people who:
-buffed brandishes
Set super rare accessories for 1/10th their cost, causing the hoarders to lose lots of money
-made chaos set the way it is now
-Neglected good suggestions by players repeatedly (like buff iron slug, winmillion)
-Failed hard in their "upgrade" to radiant sun shards
-Havent fixed their servers (swords register almost instantly for a hit, but guns take like 1 second. Why isnt that constant?)
-tons of other dumb stuff
......yeah. Dont be surprised if they do something else dumb, like make wolver have dmg high on each piece. Or asi max dmg max xtr vh bonus. Just dont expect anything smart in this update, and nothing will surprise you.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 12:21
#89
@Voza
Been around since 2011 broheim. Even those who have spent a lot of money on accessories have spent little compared to some LD players.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 12:40
#90
Boom!
@Khasmin: I know almost everything there is to know about LD, I don't need you to teach me anything. Congratulations, you can count simple variables of damage from a game. You're saying it is useless. It is useless, so why do buyers buy them? I don't know, it's pretty illogical, I would never do such things but apparently a majority of LD people do. It is situational because there is a reason that elemental defense does not work on a skolver coat; it is a reason that I am not disclosing to you people because you think you know LD when you really really don't. People need to learn how to teach themselves things and learn things on their own without depending on another person to find it out for them (once again props to Zeddy). The elemental defense UV MAX on a skolver coat DOES work. But it doesn't show up for a reason. You find that reason and then we will talk. My IGN is Icegill, I barely log on anymore, mail me when you can prove me wrong.
@Krakob: Read what I said to Khasmin but disregard the first few sentences. Elemental defense is provided, it doesn't show up in your numbers for a reason. Also there is a second reason why it doesn't work with skolver coats. It is a confusing system that OOO made. (I honestly do not know if they are aware of this or not)
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 12:48
#91
@Icegill
I do have to educate you though. Zeddy's methods are a lot more trust worthy and reliable than some random nobody on the forum.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 12:49
#92
I don't see why there'd be two proven reasons when one is enough. Prove Zeddy's formula wrong! :3
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 12:53
#93
@Icegill
"The elemental defense UV MAX on a skolver coat DOES work. But it doesn't show up for a reason."
Does it work in Lockdown? Without wearing half Vog in addition?
Double max elemental gives you around 52 elemental defence. Since it's below 100 you still only get the 100 defence from being LD, hence the elemental max is ignored. Isn't that all there's to it?
I'm a bit confused because I feel like I have all the facts except the exact formula of the dropoff once defence goes past half damage, and all that's missing is numbers, but you're saying I'm still missing things. What else is there to miss?
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 13:02
#94
In the same fashion that Status resistance UVs go from infliction to immunity between +6 and +7 (for minor) and +9.5 (for moderate), is it possible that you also need combinations of max+high with respect to defense UVs to experience a significant damage reduction?
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 13:18
#95
Haha Khamsin, so
Haha Khamsin, so unexperienced..
Icegill and I aren't best friends but he is the exact opposite of a 'random nobody'.
I have little reason to not believe him when he says he knows stuff we don't (yet).
He's hardly the only one with knowledge of the game most people don't have.
Why? Knowledge is power.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 13:17
#96
Zeddy; have you considered the Elemental max not always being 'active'?
As in defense working in stages, and skolver not having enough base ele defense to reach the second stage needed?
Could it only kick in when the health your trinkets give you is depleted?
I'm so tired of this s**t I'm willing to be your test subject/helper/whatever aids you.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 13:17
#97
@Feyi
I tend not to believe people who say "Oh, I know something, let me know about it when you figure it out". Especially not some guy I've never heard of before.
If this was like, a Chris or Magnus or someone like that, I might be willing to believe that, but who the heck is Icegill?
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 13:20
#98
Chris and magnus are overrated imo. Dragons and fairytales of ye olde ages.
Icegill dislikes it when I post with him as subject, so i'm gonna respect that.
My previous point still stands: as someone who knows LD and the playerbase well, he is no nobody.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 13:21
#99
@Khamsin Icey is a standard Aequitas. He and Feller were the funiest duo in the forum some time ago. You should know him.
Fri, 10/11/2013 - 13:22
#100
@Feyi
"Chris and magnus are overrated imo. Dragons and fairytales of ye olde ages."
Not really. I've played with them. They were really great players. They weren't innovators, but they played the game well.
I can't really think I've seen anyone of their calibur in lockdown today. Maybe Ezho... but other than that, no.
Lol zeddy, we all know what the new guns will be. You can be spoilery here.